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silenthunter19944

US CV+BB+DD above tier 4 = underpowered. IJN biased. WARNING! RAGE POST!

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US aircraft carriers

I don't even need to explain this. Shitty amount of squadron with shitty amount of squadrons that i can control. This mean that tier 4-7 US CV are only good for killing an enemy planes but even if i destroy the enemy air force i only get about 500-800exp per match. Mean while the Japanese get a shit ton amount of aircraft squadron and all the captain need to do is swarm a ship and destroy it and it will be raining exp for the IJN captain. Bullshit right?

 

US Battleships

I haven't use any high tier US BB but from what i know even the Montana which was supposed to end the Yamato is still not as good as the Yamato. HOW !?!. Low tier US BB have awful range and speed which mean that the IJN ships will have the time of their life killing USN battleships if both of the captains are equally skilled. From what i have heard US BB only get better when you get to the tier VI New Mexico. Well have fun grinding for it!

 

US Destroyers

Lower torpedoes ranges compare to the Japanese one, in most cases the IJN torpedo range is two time longer than the US one. While the US DD guns are slightly better what use is it gonna be when you are fighting a cruiser or Battleships 5+ km away.

 

US Cruisers

The only good line in the US tech tree. Good fire rate and have fun setting everyone on fire, but most of them don't have torps so the JAP cruisers will always have an advantage over you in mid-close range. 

 

OK, I am sorry for my language and this is a full rage post, but this is all true, everyone who look at the stats will know what I am talking about. Do the Japanese really have better ships than the US? Some of them. The logic here is simple IJN= simple going, have fun seal clubbing everyone/ USN= much harder to use (DD and CV) requires much more skills and sometimes is a pain to play with. I am baffled by how badly the concept of the game is, only high tier US ships don't suck and what that tell me is that War gaming don't care about lower tier US ships, they only care about the JAP ones. Just get prepared guys, once the Russian and German navy comes out what War Gaming will do just exactly like in WOT is nerf the US ships to oblivion, It will happen, the only problem is when

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Alpha Tester
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despite my 38% WR with the New York, the only bad thing I know about it is the stock hull rudder shift time

the lack of range? The issue that I can see here is that enemy cruisers can return fire at you, not being outranged by other battleships since you have lots of ways to evade long range fire.(I  mean, you like have 8-10 sec or more to change speed and course in order to evade incoming fire from 20km). You lost range for additional 2 14" guns

 

the AA protection of the NY is great too compared to Kongo because of the Bofors

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With USN CVs, air superiority is their forte, its what they're designed(in game) to do, if they also had IJN levels of anti surface capablities then whats the point in playing IJN CVs. I agree that rewards for aircraft kills should be increased.

Theres many threads already on the fourms about CVs so I won't go into details here.

 

USN Battleships: What they lack in range and speed they make up for with armour and maneuverability. A USN BB can generally take more hits then their IJN counterparts and have an easier time dodging torps with their better turning circle, later on USN Battleships also get way better AA than the IJN's. On the Montana vs Yamato, on paper it might seem that the Yamato trumps it in almost every aspect but what I experienced in CBT its quite even and comes down to RNG and the skill of the player. That being said though, if you want to sink a Yamato use aircraft and if you want to sink a Montana use a ship.

 

USN Destoryers: I didn't touch USN DD at all but from what I heard they're more Gunship style using their guns to take down IJN DDs and some CLs. You shouldn't really be going after CAs and BBs in a DD's guns, use the terrain/smoke if you really need to sink them with your torps.

Edited by Chawp

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Ok, US UP, this's quite a laugh for me. 

If you expect anything to be equal, it's as good as giving only 1 ship type. 

About USN CVs. If you don't like it then don't play, it's the way to balance the game, they are designed for air superiority. Yes, you shoot down planes doesn't get much reward, this issue is being discussed in the forums. And shooting down planes is a great way to protect your allies. I now that right now there's so much noobs who have no idea what they're doing.

Japanese CVs get a lot of aircraft, ok. They got lower amount of aircraft per squad in exchange. And IJN fighters just ***

 US BBs, Montana not as good as Yamato, lol, even an Iowa can kill Yummah toh on a 1 on 1 duel lol.

The bad thing in US BB is only the colorado, which her 1st AA rating sucks.

USN cruiser. IJN CA have better advantage at mid range, who ask you to fight at that range???. US CA is hell of a flamethrower

 

USN DDs, Use their guns, even that it's nerfed, it's still good

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Alpha Tester
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Not even play high tier BB

Saying DD torpedoes UP, without mention the firepower

Saying all USN ship tier 4 above are UP, but mention CA line are good

What is wrong with your head?

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Beta Tester
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Chill out!... What i see here is a guy, new to the game. I have no problem what so ever with USN ships. I understand that you are new to the game so you don't know how to utilize USN ships to their best.

USN low tier BB, despite of having inferior gunnery range compared to IJN BB. They perform much better in close quarter gunnery duel. They have much better armor, anti-torpedo belt and survivability than Japanese counterparts. USN BB are obviously not newbie friendly.

USN CL and CA, St. Louis has superior artillery fire power than any Japanese cruiser at low tier. It can even out gun a Furutaka at tier V. As long as you know how to play it. Phoenix and Omaha are fast, maneuverable, have torps and excellent gunnery performance. Cleveland is a DPM machine that can rip apart any vessel smaller than a battleship... What to complain about?

USN DD, terrible torpedo armament... But i love them. Because they required "a brain" and "nerve of steel" to play with. What USN DD have to do in battles is to hunt down other DD using their superior artillery, ambush big fat stupid battleships and sink them with a salvo of torps at close range. Be an HE spammer, distract enemy capital ships using your fast firing rate. force them to turn their turrets toward you and help your allies run away while using your speed and maneuverability to avoid enemy fire.

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Super Tester
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You know... If you're in a Langley and the enemy is in a Hosho, you can simply park your fighters on top of him, and he won't be able to do anything about it, since his fighters are no match for yours. His planes need to take off and land, so putting your fighters on top of him essentially neuters his ability to perform. Bam, all his planes are gone.

 

It's kind of a similar story for the higher USN CVs as well, though probably not as extreme.

Edited by benlisquare

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Super Tester
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Look at him complaining without trying to understand.

 

Have you tried adapting and going down the lines than listening what say reddit says?

 

On CVs:

-USN was forced down the air sup role, and it isn't nice that the amount of earnings is adjusted for it (there is no incentive either than clearing skies). You can choose to run strike, which is generally okay. You have tougher planes than IJN ones,

-You can always hop between the squadrons in the swarm and they should all get panicked if you can hop your fighter squadron properly.

-The effectiveness of the swarm depends on how good of a player is at the receiving end, and how good of a player is the guy in the cv.

 

On BBs:

-Try going down the line.

 

On CAs:

-Torpedo =/= Success.

 

On DDs:

-Torpedo =/= Success.

- USN DDs are mostly mobile gun platforms that can rain death on other DDs, and some CAs. Great also for chasing CVs.

Edited by ExESGO

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Beta Tester
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The troll is strong in this one... (I give you credit for admitting its a rage thread, still...)

 

USN is more than balanced with the IJN as far as I can tell from CBT experience

 

USN:

 

BB's =

+Armor  

+manoeuvrability

+AA

 

CL/CA's =

+Gunnery (Do you even cleveland?)

++AA

+Armor (less chance of citadel)

 

DD's

+No of torps (wickes, clemson and Nicholas have 12 tubes to the 4-6 of IJN)

+guns

+AA (somewhat negligible, but every bit counts at times)

 

CV's

+AA ability (ship alone)

+aircraft survivability (more planes will actually be able to make it to attacks)

+Fighter power 

+more planes per squadron, so more likely to hit or severely damage a target with 6 torps/bombs

 

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Alpha Tester
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Range is probably one of the least important stats on a battleship, in the "safe zone" where Japanese BBs can shoot at American BBs outside of their range very few shots will actually hit, let along penetrate and cause meaningful damage, the difference in speed simply means that the US BBs have to not be indecisive and commit early on, and not sit at the back of the map trying to shoot at targets as far away as possible.

 

The American cruiser line is a mixed bag, the early tiers are fairly crap aside from the St. Louis, while the mid tiers are forced to deal with the Penascola, the torpedoes on the Japanese cruisers make them more fun to play, but are situational at best, and hardly a deciding factor in a gunfight. 

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Beta Tester
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Range is probably one of the least important stats on a battleship, in the "safe zone" where Japanese BBs can shoot at American BBs outside of their range very few shots will actually hit, let along penetrate and cause meaningful damage, the difference in speed simply means that the US BBs have to not be indecisive and commit early on, and not sit at the back of the map trying to shoot at targets as far away as possible.

 

The American cruiser line is a mixed bag, the early tiers are fairly crap aside from the St. Louis, while the mid tiers are forced to deal with the Penascola, the torpedoes on the Japanese cruisers make them more fun to play, but are situational at best, and hardly a deciding factor in a gunfight. 

 

The key word here is that very few BB users pay attention to opponent battleship firing their shots, so they are always late to manouvre and quick to proclaim "HOLY [content removed] IT OUTRANGES ME! [content removed] NERF PLZ!"

 

It's clear OP is still new, and this rage thread has nothing to do with the gameplay but rather his bad experience from learning the game. We all had went through it before.

Profanity, Post Edited, User Warned

Twisted0ne

Edited by Twisted0ne

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Beta Tester
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Im a USN player and i found that my currently status is very good, agree that something need to be buff such as smoke on DD (cuz USN DD depend on gun) but for the overall i think USN ships are fine :D:D:D

 

P.S.  u mad bro ?     

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Beta Tester
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Im a USN player and i found that my currently status is very good, agree that something need to be buff such as smoke on DD (cuz USN DD depend on gun) but for the overall i think USN ships are fine :D:D:D

 

P.S.  u mad bro ?     

 

Easy, solution, show the fella the power of USN firsthand :)

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I met a USN CV player in MM 2 days ago.

 

The MM was drunk, again.

 

My team had T7 USN CV "Ranger"

 

While my enemy team had T7 IJN CV "Shokaku" and T6 IJN CV "Ryujo"

 

 

I need to say, I'm impressed. There were no TBs in the sky, even 10 kms away from the front line.

 

The "Ranger" did not get any kill, he only provide AA for the whole team.

 

We won the match. The ranger got around 1700 or so, one of the top 3 scores of the team with almost 100 planes destroyed.

 

 

I complimented him for playing so well and even sent messages to thanks for his AA cover.

 

It was a memorable match.

 

 

Underpowered? I think otherwise.

 

Edited by Menrva_Scarlet

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again, get killed by something and immediately shout "Nerf that!"

 

US UP?it seems that IJN is a bit UP instead

CV-you have absolute air superiority, 2 IJN fighter squad(8) can't defeat 1 US fighter squad(6) with allies' AA support

      US CV has infinity air superiority against IJN, while IJN CV only has a little advantage in striking

      US CV has 1 squad(6) in mid-to-low tier,2 squad(12) in high tier, it has very very much better torpedo dispersion than IJN,

      if the enemy is stupid enough, they'll eat all and die immediately

      but for IJN CV, they have 2 squad(8) in low tier, 3 squad(12) in high tier, with a disgusting torpedo dispersion

      attacking a noob BB, they'll only eat half of your torpedo, on top of that, your torpedo damage is lower than US in high tier

      Furthermore, you don't have air superiority at all, your TB has to keep hiding and sneaking

      if you make any mistake, US fighter will take away the whole bunch of TB

      while the US doesn't need to worry about these, they can just send their TB out and deal massive damage casually

 

BB- US BB trade speed and range for their gun,armor,AA and manoeuvrability

       IJN BB vs US BB, there's no advantage for any one, it mainly depends on skill(player's, not commander's)

       US BB's speed will get better in high tier

 

DD- US DD is bad in mid-low tier, great in high tier

       IJN DD is fun in low tier, awful in mid-high tier, great in top tier

       they're both awful overall

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Super Tester
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US Battleships

I haven't use any high tier US BB but from what i know even the Montana which was supposed to end the Yamato is still not as good as the Yamato. HOW !?!. Low tier US BB have awful range and speed which mean that the IJN ships will have the time of their life killing USN battleships if both of the captains are equally skilled. From what i have heard US BB only get better when you get to the tier VI New Mexico. Well have fun grinding for it!

 

And this is where I stopped reading. You haven't played a line so you make assumptions. Even though the Yamato can out range a Montana you have on the USN:

 

  • Scouts planes.
  • Gun Fire control system to increase your range by 16%.
  • Better armour.
  • Better secondaries
  • Better dispersion.
  • Better AAA.

 

Please refrain from making posts (in particularly shit poasts) when you haven't even played through the tech tree of a nation.

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Alpha Tester
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US UP?it seems that IJN is a bit UP instead

CV-you have absolute air superiority, 2 IJN fighter squad(8) can't defeat 1 US fighter squad(6) with allies' AA support

      US CV has infinity air superiority against IJN, while IJN CV only has a little advantage in striking

      US CV has 1 squad(6) in mid-to-low tier,2 squad(12) in high tier, it has very very much better torpedo dispersion than IJN,

      if the enemy is stupid enough, they'll eat all and die immediately

      but for IJN CV, they have 2 squad(8) in low tier, 3 squad(12) in high tier, with a disgusting torpedo dispersion

      attacking a noob BB, they'll only eat half of your torpedo, on top of that, your torpedo damage is lower than US in high tier

      Furthermore, you don't have air superiority at all, your TB has to keep hiding and sneaking

      if you make any mistake, US fighter will take away the whole bunch of TB

      while the US doesn't need to worry about these, they can just send their TB out and deal massive damage casually

 

I think I giggled a little, Japanese carriers underpowered? I don't know what game you are playing, but it certainly isn't wows.

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CV-you have absolute air superiority, 2 IJN fighter squad(8) can't defeat 1 US fighter squad(6) with allies' AA support

      US CV has infinity air superiority against IJN, while IJN CV only has a little advantage in striking

      US CV has 1 squad(6) in mid-to-low tier,2 squad(12) in high tier, it has very very much better torpedo dispersion than IJN,

 

 

Two IJN fighter squads(8) lose against one US fighter squad(6)? DEFINITELY NOT.

Infinity air superiority? Okay, exaggerated but agreed. But IJN CV has LITTLE advantage in striking? LOL kidding me.

US CV has 2 squads of torpedo bombers in high tier? Then he lose your INFINITY air superiority.

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Alpha Tester
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The American cruiser line is a mixed bag, the early tiers are fairly crap aside from the St. Louis, while the mid tiers are forced to deal with the Penascola, the torpedoes on the Japanese cruisers make them more fun to play, but are situational at best, and hardly a deciding factor in a gunfight. 

 

Im not entirely sure how you play through the Phoenix, Omaha and Cleveland and not come out of the experience thinking that US Cruisers are stupidly OP. And unless the Pensacola has for some reason been brutally nerfed since CBT, its not a bad ship either. 

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Beta Tester
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Funny I was expecting people crying IJN UP in SEA Server, Guess I was wrong.

me too

 

Two IJN fighter squads(8) lose against one US fighter squad(6)? DEFINITELY NOT.

Infinity air superiority? Okay, exaggerated but agreed. But IJN CV has LITTLE advantage in striking? LOL kidding me.

US CV has 2 squads of torpedo bombers in high tier? Then he lose your INFINITY air superiority.

 

8 IJN fighter vs 6 US fighter, I've seen such match several time, except the most recent one, IJN loses

idk what's the problem as WG had never buff IJN fighter/nerf US fighter, sometimes I can frankly defeat US fighter with 1 squad of IJN fighter

 

IJN CV doesn't have much advantage in striking

because of the dispersion, aiming at a noob BB, each IJN TB squad can deal maximum 2 hits(99% of time you can hit at most 2)

while US TB you can easily hit 5 or even 6 against a noob BB

2 IJN TB->2x2x8000=32000

3 IJN TB->3x2x8000=48000

1 US TB->1x6x(5000~9000damage per hit)=30000~54000

2 US TB->2x6x9000=108000

obviously US TB can deal more damage than IJN per strike

but you can say US has longer cool down and lower speed, and IJN TB can launch at different angle

but IJN doesn't have air superiority to protect their TB, and launching at different angle cannot make 4 hit per squad happens

so I believe that, overall, IJN has little advantage in striking

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me too

 

8 IJN fighter vs 6 US fighter, I've seen such match several time, except the most recent one, IJN loses

idk what's the problem as WG had never buff IJN fighter/nerf US fighter, sometimes I can frankly defeat US fighter with 1 squad of IJN fighter

 

IJN CV doesn't have much advantage in striking

because of the dispersion, aiming at a noob BB, each IJN TB squad can deal maximum 2 hits(99% of time you can hit at most 2)

while US TB you can easily hit 5 or even 6 against a noob BB

2 IJN TB->2x2x8000=32000

3 IJN TB->3x2x8000=48000

1 US TB->1x6x(5000~9000damage per hit)=30000~54000

2 US TB->2x6x9000=108000

obviously US TB can deal more damage than IJN per strike

but you can say US has longer cool down and lower speed, and IJN TB can launch at different angle

but IJN doesn't have air superiority to protect their TB, and launching at different angle cannot make 4 hit per squad happens

so I believe that, overall, IJN has little advantage in striking

 

Firstly, let me say about the IJN air strike against USN fighter defending it.

 

1. USN CV has one or two fighter squadrons. 

2. One fighter squadron can defeat one squadron of IJN but not two due to the ammo.

3. IJN have two or three squadrons of torp and some extra dive bomber squadrons.

4. USN CV fighter successfully defend one or more (at most three I think) squadrons of IJN air strike forces and going back for ammo.

5. There still exists two or three air strike forces of IJN.

6. Say it infinity air superiority.

 

Secondly, lets talk about the air strikes itself and the numbers you shown.

 

1. If you can hit 6 torps with USN torps, then I can say you can hit 3 torps with IJN bombers. So, 2 IJN TB -> 3x2x8000 = 48000, 3 IJN TB -> 3x3x8000 = 72000

2. If USN select to have two torps, then you lose your air superiority and the torps be defenseless from enemy fighters - which you are thinking that as only for IJN CV. Same thing happens when USN chooses two torps.

3. IJN's air strike benefits from their fast planes and the number of squadrons and this is the real ADVANTAGE for IJN CVThey can endure(escape) from enemy fighter with their speed, they can split the squadrons with different points, or they can just spam squadrons and only to lose one or two squadrons, make the other squadrons go through.

4. (My opinion) Nobody thinks IJN CV has little advantage in striking except... you.

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Firstly, let me say about the IJN air strike against USN fighter defending it.

 

1. USN CV has one or two fighter squadrons. 

2. One fighter squadron can defeat one squadron of IJN but not two due to the ammo.

3. IJN have two or three squadrons of torp and some extra dive bomber squadrons.

4. USN CV fighter successfully defend one or more (at most three I think) squadrons of IJN air strike forces and going back for ammo.

5. There still exists two or three air strike forces of IJN.

6. Say it infinity air superiority.

 

Secondly, lets talk about the air strikes itself and the numbers you shown.

 

1. If you can hit 6 torps with USN torps, then I can say you can hit 3 torps with IJN bombers. So, 2 IJN TB -> 3x2x8000 = 48000, 3 IJN TB -> 3x3x8000 = 72000

2. If USN select to have two torps, then you lose your air superiority and the torps be defenseless from enemy fighters - which you are thinking that as only for IJN CV. Same thing happens when USN chooses two torps.

3. IJN's air strike benefits from their fast planes and the number of squadrons and this is the real ADVANTAGE for IJN CVThey can endure(escape) from enemy fighter with their speed, they can split the squadrons with different points, or they can just spam squadrons and only to lose one or two squadrons, make the other squadrons go through.

4. (My opinion) Nobody thinks IJN CV has little advantage in striking except... you.

 

for Air Superiority,

every time my TB meets US fighter, each figher squad can take down 1.5-2 IJN squad

it also cause pressure to the player and worsen the dispersion

infinity is exaggerated, but US does have huge advantage in air superiority

 

for striking,

1.I've only hit 3 torp once, on a endangered noob, who turns when he shouldn't turn, doesn't turn when he should, turn left when he should turn right, and vice versa

till now, I haven't hit 3 torp against a BB who moves in straight line with constant speed

 

2.if US CV choose 2 TB,it must be either essex/midway, you still have 1 fighter squad

you don't have disadvantage in air superiority(against IJN) unless the IJN CV bring 4 fighter squads

 

3.IJN TB is fast, but they're slower than US fighter, you can catch them, unless they've dropped their bomb

furthermore, if you're engaging at an angle, they can't escape

they can split but you can split too, they can go together but you can too, you can even send your fighters to the IJN CV, so they'll have to lose a lot of planes

Edited by CarbonMonoxide

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[LN]
Super Tester
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Can not understand why the United States seems weaker vessel Japanese ship in the first stage, but it will take this EXP to study more and consuming more silver to buy : Izmena:

I just wanted to get discount : Mặt troll:

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