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nfcs2016

New CV mechanics

Do you like the CV Rocket plane rework in 0.10.5?  

55 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you like the CV Rocket plane rework ?

    • Yes
      9
    • No
      46

114 comments in this topic

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8
[HKN]
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Dear all 

I had try the new CV rocket mechanics both in PT server and live server as the latest 0.10.5 went live today, as some of us may  have already mentioned that the new change was too much for the rocket plane, WG motive maybe wanting to provide more survival space for DD with the  good aa, agitity and utility DD already had, i dont think this change is necessary, the new machine gun splash  before droping the rocket seems cool to have but if it dont do any damage then why bother ?  you dont see dive bomber or torpedo bomber to use their machine gun before dropping torp and bomb ? 

Added extra 5 second before dropping rocket and limited CV player to only advance aim for the target, to be honest the target would have been long gone before the rocket fire, the same damage on the rocket as before , if we are given harder to aim then maybe it should reward cv with higher rocket damage or easier to break modules, although i am not a total CV player but i do feels like this is a unfairly change 

Please kindly enlight me if i am wrong and feel free for a friendly discussion below 

 

Thank you guys and see you out there

nfcs2016

Edited by nfcs2016
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I am yet to play around properly, I'm hoping to this weekend. Having said that, on analysis.

There's a lot of possible reasons, the most obvious is noob DDs getting smacked and they wanted to reduce instances of this.

I don't think more damage is the solution, maybe some tighening of some CV rocket dispersion, maybe some loosening of others.

But the thing is, pro CVs are already adjusting and will likely barely notice the change in a month's time.

So this makes it harder for noob CVs to hunt DDs and easier for noob DDs to dodge most CVs...

Overall, DDs will feel less under pressure but they weren't getting killed by rockets (apart from a couple of CVs at issue at T8), they were getting killed by spotting.

Edited by S4pp3R
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958
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Good AA on DD , you must be joking, aside from specific boats , and there are only a handful at best , all DD today pretty much do not had any AA decent enough.

Even AA Cruisers with way more are finding it hard against aerial attacks.

The problem with plane on DD is that the whole plane Vs surface ships damage numbers are balanced for all surface targets and well then the numbers turn out too high for any DD . WG either had to reel back these numbers ( not feasible ) , made AA much stronger ( which clearly will annoy CV players even worse ), re spec all DD ( which is again not viable ) or made it harder to hit in a specific ship type and guess what ...

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I also feel the rocket planes attack mode change was unnecessary.

Now its made rocket planes completely unviable as an attack mode on dd, and any other agile ships.

The 5 extra seconds the player of the rocket planes has to now judge where the target WILL be in the future...is ....typical WeeGee i guess.

I have read they are also doing the same thing to SPG attacks in WoT, with large indicators on the ground showing the target tanks where the shots are going to land soon...

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2 hours ago, S4pp3R said:

but they weren't getting killed by rockets, they were getting killed by spotting.

^^^ this entirely. I play a lot of DDs and it is never the CV strike that I am worried about, it is the other five or six ships that open up on me once I'm spotted. I don't generally play CVs (I don't find the gameplay very interesting - and this coming from a pilot!) but I actually enjoy having CVs in the game and think that the change to rocket strikes is the wrong fix for the problem caused by CVs which is their spotting power, especially over DDs. While I applaud WG for trying to fix things I think that they need to spend a bit more time on things, perhaps play a few more games themselves and look to more complex but better solutions. There have been a number of interesting proposals in fact in these very forums, which I think deserve some exploration by WG.

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Absolutely unnecessary. I took out my Haku for a giant spin yesterday. Boy the rocket planes were terrible. How many times do you have to click just to fire? And I must have missed some nerf in a previous patch because the planes were travelling so slow to their destination and the reticle convergence was like taking forever. ANYWAY. Thank you to all you anti-cv dipsticks. CV now shit to play. 

Also, as a potato dd player, yesterday in my Gearing/Shima/Oster, I was giving middle fingers to:
Midways
MvFs
FDR
Hakus

CV OP? HA! More like those whining are terrible dd players.

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5 minutes ago, blauflamme22 said:

^^^ this entirely. I play a lot of DDs and it is never the CV strike that I am worried about, it is the other five or six ships that open up on me once I'm spotted. I don't generally play CVs (I don't find the gameplay very interesting - and this coming from a pilot!) but I actually enjoy having CVs in the game and think that the change to rocket strikes is the wrong fix for the problem caused by CVs which is their spotting power, especially over DDs. While I applaud WG for trying to fix things I think that they need to spend a bit more time on things, perhaps play a few more games themselves and look to more complex but better solutions. There have been a number of interesting proposals in fact in these very forums, which I think deserve some exploration by WG.

You bugger, just hitting reply as I hit mine. 😛

Yes, Completely agree with your DD assessment. Every time I play dd, I don't find problems with the issues that keep being incessantly pounded out.

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SMH at the whole thing from announcement to implementation.

Shake.

My.

Head.

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Why didn’t they just implement some mechanic where CV rockets do 20% less damage to DD and specifically DD. True, it may not have made sense, but it’s not like half they stuff makes sense these days anyway.

Sounds like they just made CVs harder to use.

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Rocket plane should not be exist from the first place....

This change is necessary because SOME DD HAVE NO SMOKE AT ALL. This change is actually better compare to increase DD AA. This is win win solution, player that have higher skill should be distinguished from the noob. 

I am playing both DD and CV, and i know its impossible to Dodge CV rocket. CV by design should be effective againts heavy armored target... Not againts something cute small DD. The nerf of AP bomb is actually not good.

__________________________

But truly, this strafing should be improved. The rocket aiming should be farther! So i can bypass powerfull AA..... This could be good trade off

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4 minutes ago, Skarhabek said:

-Torpedo into the rudder...-

The problem now is that the game is directionless (except for the filthy lucre bit) like bismarck's rudder being hit by a torpedo.

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5 hours ago, Skarhabek said:

Rocket plane should not be exist from the first place....

...

 

WG should instead implemented for real CAP, what we had right now is a type of plane not really belong and ill balanced, and yet lack a type of plane that do vital role

Edited by Mechfori
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1 hour ago, Grygus_Triss said:

Why didn’t they just implement some mechanic where CV rockets do 20% less damage to DD and specifically DD. True, it may not have made sense, but it’s not like half they stuff makes sense these days anyway.

Sounds like they just made CVs harder to use.

I actually had some ideas but idk where to find them, @S4pp3R has them somewhere but I cant dig it out of the darklab. 

EDIT: That was for flak spawns vs good CV players nvm.

 

But either way, they could give them a saturation gimmick against rockets, less damage against DDs, or even just make it minimal spotting oh wait they don't like how its attacking nothing. There are a variety of proposed solutions to this but the machine guns are just unnecessary. AND FOR GOD SAKE NERF THE T8 RETICLES FIRST BEFORE DOING THIS. There is Enterprise, SHokaku, Lexington, all able to do (and very consistently) 7-10k damage on a DD in one strike. This didn't fix that, it made DDs more confident in straightlining with AA on. Hey at least it makes my life easier.

Edited by Impersonation_Gaming
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Played a couple of CV games last night. I play all classes. The rockets are unusable now. Even MVR rockets are tough to hit cruisers citadels now with the active dodging and not being able to adjust my aim after the machine gun animation is activated. CVs don't do much damage to DDs anyway except maybe Midway's dive bombers. This nerf is too much and unnecessary. Expect CV population to drop

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Just take the advice guys.  If you are good enough you will not notice in a month's time.  If you are not good enough then accept that you are in fact a noob and it was the CV making you look good not your skills. Just ask S4pp3r  🙂

 

7 hours ago, S4pp3R said:

But the thing is, pro CVs are already adjusting and will likely barely notice the change in a month's time.

 

Edited by Rub1c0n

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8 minutes ago, Rub1c0n said:

Just take the advice guys.  If you are good enough you will not notice in a month's time.  If you are not good enough then accept that you are in fact a noob and it was the CV making you look good not your skills. Just ask S4pp3r  🙂

 

 

Nope. I disagree. Most CVs are going to go after BBs to farm damage instead of wasting time on DDs. Not spotting and hunting DDs mean that other ships can get farmed and torped easily by the DDs. More players are going to sit back due to the threat from DDs. Enjoy the new unfortunate toxic norm. Guess no one can blame CVs any more for not hunting DDs. That is how most players are going to adapt to new norms. 

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1 minute ago, AdmiralYamamoto8 said:

Nope. I disagree. Most CVs are going to go after BBs to farm damage instead of wasting time on DDs. Not spotting and hunting DDs mean that other ships can get farmed and torped easily by the DDs. More players are going to sit back due to the threat from DDs. Enjoy the new unfortunate toxic norm. Guess no one can blame CVs any more for not hunting DDs. That is how most players are going to adapt to new norms. 

Yep. The unicum cvs are going remain unicum while the mid-level plebs like us are just going to find other things to play. So you will have even more lethal cvs. Then more complaints and more nerfs, eventually arriving back at the square one situation for the raison d'etre for "rework".

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what a load of BS , cv are still way overpowered , AA does nothing to the still 

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2 hours ago, AdmiralYamamoto8 said:

Played a couple of CV games last night. I play all classes. The rockets are unusable now. Even MVR rockets are tough to hit cruisers citadels now with the active dodging and not being able to adjust my aim after the machine gun animation is activated. CVs don't do much damage to DDs anyway except maybe Midway's dive bombers. This nerf is too much and unnecessary. Expect CV population to drop

yup total crap CV are still way op 

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Imagine not using torpedo bombers to hit DDs.

I've always practiced using torp  bombers vs DDs and it produced pretty good results as the guaranteed damage you do is higher than using rockets.

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16 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

Yep. The unicum cvs are going remain unicum while the mid-level plebs like us are just going to find other things to play. So you will have even more lethal cvs. Then more complaints and more nerfs, eventually arriving back at the square one situation for the raison d'etre for "rework".

They will probably buff CVs when the population drops since they are fully invested in the CV rework. 

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2 minutes ago, Ryuuoh_DeltaPlus said:

Imagine not using torpedo bombers to hit DDs.

I've always practiced using torp  bombers vs DDs and it produced pretty good results as the guaranteed damage you do is higher than using rockets.

Yeah I do that sometimes.They do more damage against DDs but it raises the question on why nerf rocket planes in the first place? They are not even that powerful as compsred to landing a torp. Besides, Torp planes are used to hit cruisers and BBs too. With the rocket plane nerf, CVs will run out of torp planes by not cycling through rubbish rocket planes now.

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Plane can only spot 2.5 km away from DD as they have all the margin to either make a saver passage to the cap or choose to return next to cruiser for some extra aa defence this is regardless rather DD have smoke or not, DD without smoke like Halland have excellent AA to defence with, like i mentioned before i am not a full time CV but with this Rocket change  really damage the playing experience, the old rocket plane version is just as good as they are, if a DD choose to show it broadside to Rocket plane and have 1/3 or 2/3 of health taken away then its their lost, just like citidal hit noithing really wrong about it,                                                                                                                                                                                         

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18 minutes ago, nfcs2016 said:

Plane can only spot 2.5 km away from DD as they have all the margin to either make a saver passage to the cap or choose to return next to cruiser for some extra aa defence this is regardless rather DD have smoke or not, DD without smoke like Halland have excellent AA to defence with, like i mentioned before i am not a full time CV but with this Rocket change  really damage the playing experience, the old rocket plane version is just as good as they are, if a DD choose to show it broadside to Rocket plane and have 1/3 or 2/3 of health taken away then its their lost, just like citidal hit noithing really wrong about it,                                                                                                                                                                                         

not every smokeless DD are Halland, and not all DD are T8/T9/T10 , French DD suffers ( and they do not get 2.5KM aerial concealment ) , and so do old IJN boats ( which had practically misery AA ). Its the number game, when its balanced for the average , then its not balanced for the mighty nor the poor and this is very much the case with DD vs planes in the most exaggerated manner . Picture yourself in a T6 Shinonome , which had a grand AA rating of 1 , you cannot defend yourself against even a T4 CV , or you get into a French DD , your typical AA is almost always less than 100 ( most are only something like 50+ ) Continuous out to roughly 3.5KM, even Kleber barely made it over the century mark at 102 DPS ..

there lies the problem , a large portion of DD on hand just do not even able to stop the 2nd, 3rd or even 4th attack waves ( unless it get into AA bubble of teammate, then they get scolded for being noobish cause the are now not at the front doing their so call DD thing ) ; the game mean for the DD to vanguard but do not provide the mean for it to defend itself when vanguarding

The part with rocket planes is that their numbers are balanced not only against DD, but also others as I've mentioned prior, which made them numerically far too OP against DD in general, and yet most DD simply do not had the AA to mitigate ( stop that 2nd, 3rd, 4th attack run ) , people forget that speed bleed off real quick in a DD once it stat maneuvering , so while it might be able to turn, dodge the 1st attack run and take minimal damage , its not quite the case when follow up runs are taken into concern.  And of course planes can easily out maneuver any surface ships

IMHO the whole change is a faulted mechanism put on top of another faulted mechanism , we cannot just look at all the high tier dd vs the high tier CV, CV start at T4, and well we all know how those mid an low tier come about when CV are present ... if this change prove giving the needed breathing space for low and mid tier surface ships, I am all for it , as for the high tier , well not every boat got mighty AA and the CV player had disposal of Torp, Bomber and Attack planes.

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38 minutes ago, nfcs2016 said:

Plane can only spot 2.5 km away from DD as they have all the margin to either make a saver passage to the cap or choose to return next to cruiser for some extra aa defence this is regardless rather DD have smoke or not, DD without smoke like Halland have excellent AA to defence with, like i mentioned before i am not a full time CV but with this Rocket change  really damage the playing experience, the old rocket plane version is just as good as they are, if a DD choose to show it broadside to Rocket plane and have 1/3 or 2/3 of health taken away then its their lost, just like citidal hit noithing really wrong about it,                                                                                                                                                                                         

This rework forces planes to guess where the DD is due to the two step delayed animation. Almost impossible to attack DDs and also fast moving cruisers

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