A double-edged solution for one particular problem

[Reinhard_of_Avercland]

So I was binging on the old raw footages on my replays. And I found out there was a DD in Twilight Battle that was equipped with a consumable that screws up the dispersion of the incoming fires. I know the consumable is too ridiculous to be implemented on normal ships. But with some tweaks here & there, I don't think it would be as ridiculous as the original one. But we've got some ridiculous consumables at this state, so this one could actually fit. Here are the parameters

• Name: Fire Control Countermeasure (because it literally messes up the enemies' fire control system).
• Description: Increases the dispersion of all incoming salvo & reduces the accuracy of the plane-based attacks.
• Stats: Increases the dispersion of incoming salvo by "X" %, and prevents the most optimal drop pattern of rockets, bombs, and torpedoes.
• Duration: May vary (15-30 seconds).
• Number of charges: 5 (base) or 7 with SI & premium version of it.
• Cooldown: May vary.

 

Long story short, smoke has become less reliable in some situations. And of course smoke is no longer a thing exclusively for DDs. So this consumable should be able to mend the current problem that DDs suffer. However there are some cons with this consumable, and I won't deny it:

1. This consumable would not fix the skill gap between the pro & the "average" because the former can always exploit the things better than the latter.
2. Knowing WG, this consumable might eventually be given on non-DDs after some time.

 

I know this one is a weird suggestion that not everyone may agree. But this is the only possible thing that could have been implemented for the DD Rework. No this one should not be a gimmick to one line. It should be universal for all DDs.

[dejiko_nyo]

Chaff! Chaff! Flare! Flare!

[Mechfori]

My take .. won't work .. period right now the major issue with DD is that the class is not given or rather deny its feature and specialty by putting too many too effective counter measure in game and basically the game meta out range the class as a general clause ... WG try French DD ( super fast mad dash brawler ) .. well it does not work , sure it give somewha a new or rather renew style to the game but its Soviet DD all over .. now they try another gimmick in Euro DD and I cannot see it bring back DD the class and the variety of play the class should had and that should bring to the game. With that it also stagnate the whole game for other class as there lacks an injection of element that would force them not to ( namely DD that actually can play and effective efficient at range thus placed upon the game )

The said consumable do nothing towards any of the problems on hand

[Danhvn_1]

Actually, the consumable is already in the game. It's called Kutnetzov's "Will to Victory" talent.

[Lowyat]

i'd limit it to incoming rockets though. too ovepowered on normal shells which is already dependent on rng for ambush or tactical agression

[Reinhard_of_Avercland]

1 hour ago, Mechfori said:

My take .. won't work .. period right now the major issue with DD is that the class is not given or rather deny its feature and specialty by putting too many too effective counter measure in game and basically the game meta out range the class as a general clause ... WG try French DD ( super fast mad dash brawler ) .. well it does not work , sure it give somewha a new or rather renew style to the game but its Soviet DD all over .. now they try another gimmick in Euro DD and I cannot see it bring back DD the class and the variety of play the class should had and that should bring to the game. With that it also stagnate the whole game for other class as there lacks an injection of element that would force them not to ( namely DD that actually can play and effective efficient at range thus placed upon the game )

The said consumable do nothing towards any of the problems on hand

I forgot to say the main goal of this consumable.

Right now one of the major issue with DD is the fact they are often dead once spotted, whether by CVs, or radar, or DD with better concealment. This consumable is aimed to prevent or postpone the moment the DD becomes dead once spotted by swatting all incoming shells throughout the consumable's duration. And the only thing that could counter this consumable is another consumable that works the otherwise (the one that improves the ship's gun dispersion). And I don't think that one will ever be implemented for obvious reasons.

1 hour ago, Danhvn_1 said:

Actually, the consumable is already in the game. It's called Kutnetzov's "Will to Victory" talent.

That only works once & only for Soviet ships though...

 

52 minutes ago, Lowyat said:

i'd limit it to incoming rockets though. too ovepowered on normal shells which is already dependent on rng for ambush or tactical agression

I thought the same initially. But nowadays DDs are mostly killed by surface ships because they get spotted. CV's spotting is the most common case (which is why the hatred against CVs still stands), followed by radar.(which is another thing DDs hate). Yes this consumable would sting for BBs, but cruisers are the main target of this consumable. However I included all plane-based attacks because bombs can also work against DDs (except AP bombs) while torpedoes.... sometimes work too (only against the most potato though).

Depending on the unspecified parameters like the consumable's duration & cooldown, I'm sure it can be tweaked enough to not make it overpowered.

[Mechfori]

well I think in the end  just prolonging the misery do not actually made it work .. yes the DD can live that bit longer ( might be ) but in the end its still lacking what should be provided as provided to all other class of ships .. viable defense .. working offense , and measure to counter the other class ( some more effective, some less but at least there are for all the other class , but denied to DD ) and of course RANGE .. a DD with the said consumable still a DD that can do nothing if its out ranged and basically always driven to run for its life ..

Today I was in a game T8/9/10 mixed with 5 Radar ( 4 soviet and 1 USS ) and IJN T10 CV , well the other side's DD got it light only 1 SN and 1 USS Radar and USS T10 Midway ; oh and not to mention so many Hydro and long range secondaries on Cruiser / BB still ; its like right away nothing a DD can do if the map is saturated with counter measures and counter measures and that is not what any DD spec or consumable can do , its both WG, and the player base , and of course the MM 

Can we see a pattern when we see more Gearing ,Shima these days .. and no less long range ( for a DD ) HE Spamming Friesland / Kita etc etc .... its of course a reflection that all the DD are driven to be unable to get into effective range of where they were suppose to be - but not so - and the only option left is well ... ask our Shimakaze and Ashashio players about it.

I propose instead DD smoke to be specialized to had chaff effect also which when in smoke , reduce enemy Radar detection range by 50% flat and all DD smoke should had that , and as well number of smoke charge as well as the cool down duration need to see a not insignificant buff to all DDs ( and for some duration of smoke also ) , and upon that also Radar detection should change to made it able to be used not just for said absolute range against DD, it should had also be buffed to let the Radar be more of a tool to also light up big enemy targets further out , the current 7.5/8.5/9/10/12 KM detection to DD should be a stat, they should be changed to be ale to detect Cruiser at 1.2X of the said range and 1.5X against BB , this will force guns to be more dynamic and not sitting still always. Stealth, Speed, and Maneuverability is what constitute DD defense and those are denied by counter  measure like Radar, Hydro, and planes, and long range secondaries, super fast cruiser and BB ( care to see a race between Amalfi and Akizuki at 37 vs 33 knot , its kind of hilarious ) - this is something WG need to work on and I do not see a any particular that can do that .. if you fashion such into the game then you should buff the stealth a lot to balance that out for stealth approach based DD, and buff the speed and maneuverability a lot for those gunboats to balance out the excessive advantage now BB and Cruiser had ( no to mention all the CB's HP / armor and gun ) but for all DD the issue is that they will never had the Hp and the armor , so that mean they must had these provided all of 3 of them to made up actual defense, you take away any single one the defense just do not work

But even with this , its still not enough, it might do some to the defense, but it do nothing to the offense and ranging and that part need buff also to almost all DD , its a simple case of Gun and Torpedo range as well as speed / detection of Torpedoes ( shall we talk IJN Torp again ) and the same for guns. German DD probably best illustrate that with fast reloading and even ( what's  considered good and enough back then ) 10/10.5KM torp at high tier and guns that can be spec to fire out to 14KM ... and even Hydro that can challenge enemy DD .. well none of that really matte cause the engagement now is more like 15, 18, 20KM out .. and if you take about getting them to push into those 10KM range you are back to the defense part and stealth

and even with that, if the game penalize DD for going out to do the needed tactical thing as not rewarding them for all the tactical task they are asked to do .. in the end players will be driven to not to do those task .. spotting , area denial, giving smoke to teammate , flank screening , the list go on and on .. all present a case of putting the DD in danger without duely rewarding them and not giving them ( as mentioned earlier ) the offense and defense to be able to carry out the task in any consistent effective efficient manner ..

When a game flatly discriminate against a certain class of ships , you cannot hope to remediate the issue by saying you put in a consumable that just happen to might be able to let it take less hits ( but you can still be single shot easily ) ... does it sound actually positive at all

[dejiko_nyo]

I think it is safe to say whatever the gimmick we suggest, we don't trust wg to handle it properly.

[S0und_Theif]

13 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

I think it is safe to say whatever the gimmick we suggest, we don't trust wg to handle it properly.

Hear, Hear!

[Reinhard_of_Avercland]

22 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

I think it is safe to say whatever the gimmick we suggest, we don't trust wg to handle it properly.

I suggest this gimmick for all DDs only. But I have no doubt WG will give it to a new line instead.....

But hey my suggestion is backed by experience & facts, unlike some know-it-all with weirder suggestions.

[TakemoriKohoto]

On 3/16/2020 at 6:20 PM, Sir_Feather said:

I suggest this gimmick for all DDs only. But I have no doubt WG will give it to a new line instead.....

But hey my suggestion is backed by experience & facts, unlike some know-it-all with weirder suggestions.

As an CV player, this actually might sound fair the most to basically anyone. I see no harm and beside now i had excuse for stop clapping those loli bote cheek, goddamit it's annoying just when you about to go do some dmg farm with AP bomb and they kept asking for more dd recon