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AxEyBoI

German Dispersion

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132
[SPCTH]
Member
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I thought they improved this. Took out my Tirpitz and could not hit a broadside BB from 12km not moving.................. missed entirely, landed all around before, and over the top and front of the bow and stern. I was like wtf .............. and this is not just a one off thing, the next few salvos at 10k and 15km resulted in pretty poor grouping. The spread is massive, like nothing has changed. Oh well back to playing other ships.

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693
[MALD]
[MALD]
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I think you expected way too much...even though the dispersion pattern changed to that of the Americans (i believe it's spread horizontally), their sigma is still lower, hence inaccuracy still is the main signature of KM.

Edited by Earl_of_Arland

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270
[TWR]
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Think of it like when the Aussie government says they are gonna give us a big tax break to help people out,and we end up with an extra 20 cents a week in our pay packet.

All talk and no effective action!

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1,062
[LBAS]
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Its improved on FDG and Bismarck, now did  more shatter than before in Bismarck and finally can hit target in 10km in FDG. 

Also Tirpitz have Torpedo for ranked

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1,629
[FORCE]
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8 hours ago, Earl_of_Arland said:

I think you expected way too much...even though the dispersion pattern changed to that of the Americans (i believe it's spread horizontally),

Yup even the American's dispersion can be frustrating unless your build is fully at dispersion which is only possible for tier 9 & 10. My Scharnhorst & PEF still behave as usual (I barely feel any difference)..

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164
[POI]
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Well, after several games in GK, I do feel the guns are more reliable. Not as good as Yamato (without legendary mods), Montana (with 6th slot dispersion upgrade), but I can feel it is more reliable, and the damage count achieved by main gun improved by maybe... 10 to 15%

I have no time to play FDG yet, and only sailed once on Bismarck and Tirpitz since last patch update, so far it felt better, though still trollish at times. 

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243
[TWR]
Alpha Tester
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Tirpitz is STILL the Dudpitz as mentioned in previous posts.

Not all ze germans got buffs.

And frankly apart from a temporary buff the Dudpitz got some 1 year post release that only lasted a couple months before they re-nerfed it...its AP is worthless.

 

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[CLAY]
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Just now, Dread_Pirate_BlackHeart said:

Tirpitz is STILL the Dudpitz as mentioned in previous posts.

Not all ze germans got buffs.

And frankly apart from a temporary buff the Dudpitz got some 1 year post release that only lasted a couple months before they re-nerfed it...its AP is worthless.

 

Tirpitz doesn't need it... for the 1v1 ranked anyway.

Tirpitz just needs to sit in the middle of the caps and wait for stuff to get close.

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836
[SMOKE]
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well yes its improved, but its like instead of needing to be well within 10KM to made consistent hits before its now like you can push that to close to 10KM , still only good for brawl and hoping ( and wishing ) RNG goddess smile on you when you try anything mid range and you will need almost a near-miracle at long range still

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132
[SPCTH]
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I have both versions of the Tirpz, with a brawler and long range setup. Both at T8 is very ordinary considering all enemy at that Tier. If T9-10 then you may as well scuttle. There just so bad i cant bare to play them but i do cos i have them. The Vlad, Alwama, Massa, Lenin and Richy plays so much better. Even my Hood feels stronger at a lower tier. German BBs are DUDS and not competitive. WG has failed once again.

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132
[SPCTH]
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Used the Turdpuz  and yous were not wrong about the AP at 8-10km cruisers full Broad i got 1-2k damage with 2-3 shell hits................................... what gives, happen 3x in a game...............WG really messed the German ships to DD level penetration.

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243
[TWR]
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Its been like this since release....I have always advocated this.

So glad other players are starting to release how completely under powered this turd is.

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270
[TWR]
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Was going through Sub_Octavians posts on reddit ,initially to see his response on the latest PR 'fun and enaging' issues inivloving Earl's tweets,and came across stuff on the German BB dispersion changes.

Apparently it was viewed as a quality of life change,not a proper buff:

https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/dzncay/germans_are_bacc/f89rpz0/?context=3

Quote

It’s barely any different that it was.... at point blank range the difference is largest and it’s still a smaller difference than ships with or without the 7% range module (at like 15km it’s less than 2% better that it use to be for example). The Germans just needed better firing angles T9/10 and a sigma buff or something for T7 for the low barrel count.

level 2
9 points · 1 month ago
3 points here:
  1. As I said, we needed QoL, not a major performance buff.

  2. Dont forget about hydro mod and legendary commander - these are indirect buffs.

  3. That's actually not all we have for Ze Germans in mind, there is another thing being worked on, but if it is approved, it will take a bit more time to deliver (early 2020 I sincerely hope).

 
level 3
3 points · 1 month ago
 

Explain #3 What else is being considered?

 
level 4
12 points · 1 month ago
 

We will publish it in DevBlog when we're sure :-) But it has something to do with secondary builds wink wink

 

Also as shown at the bottom,it looks like they are may do something with secondaries in 2020.Although given the dispersion changes it probably won't be anything to get excited about.

He also talks about KM BB in general and buffs here as well:

https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/dfi0hd/playerbase_talking_to_wargaming_about_buffing/f3674fc/

Quote

That's a funny meme, and yes, we will buff German BB (ETA: 0.8.11 for general line buffs and we will also consider doing something with secondaries builds in 2020 when we're done with most of current tasks).

But if we decompose it (Kaptain Zur Ovbvious says I still understand that it's a joke, sure):

German battleships came to the game three years ago

So what? There are a lot of super old ships in the game, and they are still absolutely viable.

They trade good secondaries for main batter accuracy

No, they also trade good armor and citadel immunity + hydro from T8

New lines and premiums have better accuracy and secondaries than them, meaning power creep

Unfortunately, this is not true, because ship specs work together. E.g. FR BB secondaries are great, but they lack punch (pen) and overall FR BB are not good in CQC as their armor does not offer the same protection, and they don't have hydro. Upgrading FR BB for brawling is an option, but it is quite sub optimal, while with KM BB this is fully viable (apart from the highest competitive cases).

Spreadsheet says they are fine

They are, indeed, and there is nothing wrong in acknowledging it. To prevent some really weird questions about "that's because potatoes play them!", this is not true, and I looked at their data relative to the players skill extensively. We made special data pull for KM BB players for last few months and compared their solo KM BB stats with their solo stats on other BB on respective tier + broke it down by percentile of player overall WR.

The WR on KM BB relatively to other BB and player WR is fine - they usually occupy the middle positions. And actually, looks like that top players make KM BB work best. For example, top 5% of players achieve not "fine" but the best WR on Grosser Kurfurst among all T10 BB lines: 73% WR on G.K., 71% on Conqueror and Republique, 70% on Montana and 67% on Yamato. But top 5% of players is extreme of course but it's the trend - the better account WR is, the better rankings KM BB show. On the other hand, of course they are not the best BB for raw damage: the same top 5% of players deal 118k average damage on G.K., while on Montana they 121k, 126k on Yamato, etc, etc. This trend is more or less same for all KM BB down to Bayern - lacking in raw damage, but still showing good battle influence (obviously because tanking and scouting).

Then you can ask why we are going to buff them if they are so good? Well, because of your feedback and perception :-) We do understand that your experience on these ships is not just numbers in the data pull. However, our challenge is to improve them but not overdo it. It is extremely important especially with KM BB because they, well, are the most, sometimes by large margin, popular BBs in the game. And because they objectively do not underperform, we want to take it slow and easy. As I said, if everything goes ok, some good changes will happen in 0.8.11, and then we will see what 2020 brings in terms of opportunities to address them more.

Cheers!

 

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757
[SALT]
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I will just parroting what I said before in here 🤣🤣

German and British dispersion curve is as trash as Krauts. Anyone that play UK and US line should already know that

US were considered accurate because they have BETTER SIGMA (NC 2.0 sigma, IOWA : 1.9)  and access to Artillery Plotting Room Modification 2 (-11% dispersion)

Anyone that play UK BB line know how frustating AP and accuracy of Cnoqkek, Lion, monarch etc. since Most people spam HE, so its not realy noticable

 

3013c6d38e.png

e8ce29025d.png

Base accuracy from proship.ru. K*cyrlic* is Kremlin, C*cyrlic* is Slava. AF is angle of shell Fall

 

only at around 8km that the Dispersion behavior, you would feel the KMS hit become a lot more consistent. If you notice bla2 in shooting 15km++ target, that preaty much RNG, Placebo and falacy on your part lol

But notice how supperior Russian advertised "worse at range", perform consistently better, beaten only by Thunderer which famed for its accurate gun. if you want to ask why Russian BattleBias is top competitive pick, thats the reason fellas :fish_haloween:

Edited by humusz
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