How does the combo (money x time) Puerto Rico grind work?

[Rina_Pon]

Ah ... well, Youtube WoWS CCs really lit up in the last 24h, flamu, jingles and the rest all lining up to explain how,

1. Pueto Rico costs $250 US in doubloons to buy outright.

2. The ship isn't worth $250 US. (plenty of entertaining vids explaining exactly why, well worth the trip to YT)

and

3. The grind required to get the ship for free is excessive, with much focus on the last two directives of the mission tree which have been shown to be for all intents and purposes impossible.

Ok, so just hear me out for a second. I'm not interested in getting the ship so much as I am in trying to figure out how the event is structured.

We agree that WG have screwed up in that the last stages of the all-free grind were supposed to be effectively impossible, not actually impossible. Either way though, the idea behind these events is to milk the each player for as much as he or she is willing or able to pay. At the first stage, there as those who will pay for the ship outright at a massive premium in return for the privilege of early access. Then theres a sliding scale of players who will pay a variable amount of money to lighten the grind, buying a specific premium ship or containers or boosters. As well as, in a secondary knock on effect, additional flags, camo, premium time etc.

My guess is that the median cost WG plans players to pay for this ship is about $70: basically the full price of a TX premium (if there was such a thing) discounted a little for work done. To pay less than that makes the grind exponentially more difficult. WG just miscalculated the curve a little where it intercepts zero cost. Perhaps because they used the same formula they previously used for T6-9 giveaway ships like Cossack and PEF. Perhaps they hadn't modeled it for TX.

What none of the YT vids so far have answered is what the grind looks like if you buy the three boosters initially. Which costs I think about $70. You should need fewer tokens which I think means you won't need to complete the infamous later directives.

Can anyone confirm that for me please?

 

[S4pp3R]

You know the thing I don't get with this sort of thing...?

At what point do you as a human go "you know what, this game we've made is making enough money to buy a small European country, why don't we make it a bit fairer on our customers?"

Obviously WG never will but instead go in the completely opposite direction...

I just don't understand though, look after your customers and they'll bring you more customers - surely that's the way it's supposed to work, right? Right guys...? Right??? Don't leave me hanging here!!

See this is why I serve my country, not work in the private sector, I'm just not built to squeeze people out of their hard earned dollaroos...

[Darkworld_2015]

21 minutes ago, S4pp3R said:

 

At what point do you as a human go "you know what, this game we've made is making enough money to buy a small European country, why don't we make it a bit fairer on our customers?"

 

I just don't understand though, look after your customers and they'll bring you more customers - surely that's the way it's supposed to work, right? Right guys...? Right??? Don't leave me hanging here!!

See this is why I serve my country, not work in the private sector, I'm just not built to squeeze people out of their hard earned dollaroos...

Capitalism is to gain as much as possible, some with a good long term plan, while others just wanna get it fast. 

Small store operators also understand that if they treat their customers well with good food and reasonable prices, customers will be back for more, even bringing family and friends together. This no need rocket science. 

I work in public sector too.

[Thyaliad]

43 minutes ago, S4pp3R said:

You know the thing I don't get with this sort of thing...?

At what point do you as a human go "you know what, this game we've made is making enough money to buy a small European country, why don't we make it a bit fairer on our customers?"

That's capitalism. It is not enough to make some money, you need to make more money. If possible, all the money. So you use your money to make more money. Then use it to make even more money. Continue ad infinitum.

That is why a lot of these 'live service' games bombards the player with constant grinds and events. It is not enough to have your time, they must have all of your time. They don't want you playing other games and spending money elsewhere.

47 minutes ago, S4pp3R said:

I just don't understand though, look after your customers and they'll bring you more customers - surely that's the way it's supposed to work, right? Right guys...? Right??? Don't leave me hanging here!!

Only if those new customers bring in more money than if you were to try and fleece the whales.

Take this PR event for example. Some whales will pay, some unhappy players will stop playing in disgust, while most won't care or will forget about it and open their wallet the next time they see something they like. If the extra money WG squeezes out from the whales is greater than the amount they could have gotten from the quitters, then those quitters are acceptable collateral damage.

[Gummiheng]

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/206593-easy-to-understand-math-why-a-free-puerto-rico-is-mathematically-possible-possible-≠-practical/

 

[Thyaliad]

3 hours ago, Rina_Pon said:

What none of the YT vids so far have answered is what the grind looks like if you buy the three boosters initially. Which costs I think about $70. You should need fewer tokens which I think means you won't need to complete the infamous later directives.

Yes you would only need to complete the first 3 directives and get the daily shipments.

If you are planning to buy three premium boosters:

• The first directive should be completed within 7 days after the directive’s start;
• The second directive should be completed within 7 days of finishing the previous one;
• The third directive should be completed within 14 days of finishing the previous one;
• You should collect all rewards from Daily Shipments;
• You don’t need tokens from Daily Missions at all (they will only give you an additional boost);
• And be sure to spend your tokens as soon as possible.

That is from Sub_Octavian's Reddit apology:

 

[Rina_Pon]

8 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

Yes you would only need to complete the first 3 directives and get the daily shipments.

Thanks. That clarified things immensely. It's like I suspected: the grind difficulty is adjustable from impossible to mild depending on whether you buy 0,1,2, or all 3 boosters. If you really want to devote your time to getting this ship, and you are an experienced, good player with premium time and plenty of high tier ships, its quite possible to achieve without spending too much money.

Not zero money. Just not too much money.

Gorizia for free is grindy, but achievable within a similar time frame and skill set.

[Rina_Pon]

2 hours ago, S4pp3R said:

At what point do you as a human go "you know what, this game we've made is making enough money to buy a small European country, why don't we make it a bit fairer on our customers?"

Everyone should appreciate the huge amount of effort devoted at WG to optimizing the money-making parts of the game. A lot of psychological manipulation goes into the design of these events, really hardcore stuff that's not, to be honest, very pleasant at all if you start to look at it closely - particularly when you consider the vulnerable people who not only get sucked into the gambling aspect, but also fall for the kind of mind games that convinces people to pay $250 US for Puerto Rico up front. Of which there were plenty on evidence over the last 48h. But, let's face it, paying the equivalent cost of an AAA video game and then some just for in-game items is already questionable, and I'm as guilty here as anyone.

I contribute financially to WG. I look at it as an expense in lieu of a monthly subscription and I personally prefer this voluntary, pay-as-you-go, model to fixed fees. I'm not blind to the negative aspects, it's just I'm willing to look the other way since its not me that pays for it. That sounds horrible and it probably is.

[Rina_Pon]

1 hour ago, Gummilicious said:

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/206593-easy-to-understand-math-why-a-free-puerto-rico-is-mathematically-possible-possible-≠-practical/

This is also useful. If I have this right, buying all three boosters means you only need to grind 16,000 instead of 55,000 points, and the event would end on Day 15, Christmas day. Coincidence I think not!

[dejiko_nyo]

*sigh* People keep forgetting the other half of the equation: the grindy bit. Unless you are a automated account and have no life, consider that there is essentially very little leeway even if you buy the boosters. That is what pisses people off.

[Rina_Pon]

1 hour ago, dejiko_nyo said:

*sigh* People keep forgetting the other half of the equation: the grindy bit. Unless you are a automated account and have no life, consider that there is essentially very little leeway even if you buy the boosters. That is what pisses people off.

What mostly seems to have got people freaking out is the insanity of the zero-cash grind. No one has really commented on the cash-boosted grind, but the first three directives, given the boosters also extend the time limit, is not that difficult to complete ... at least if you have the ships and premium time.

[Gummiheng]

1 hour ago, Rina_Pon said:

No one has really commented on the cash-boosted grind, but the first three directives, given the boosters also extend the time limit, is not that difficult to complete ... at least if you have the ships and premium time.

Alot People do not want to spend that x amount of cash on a ship, including you yourself, so they try to went  for the free way but then the free way is just way too absurd to grind finish 

 

and again, this doesnt seem like a upgraded Alaska as claimed by wargaming

yeah 4x3 310mm gun but it comes with montana dispersion

 

[Rina_Pon]

5 minutes ago, Gummilicious said:

Alot People do not want to spend that x amount of cash on a ship, including you yourself, so they try to went  for the free way but then the free way is just way too absurd to grind finish 

I don't want to spend cash for a high tier US CA, mostly because I've never gelled with the US cruiser lines. The difference between me and a lot of players it seems is unlike them I don't expect to be able to get it for free just because WG said it was possible. I know without asking that it would always be far above my pay grade. Whether it is in reality technically possible or technically impossible is not much of a concern to me.

[Thyaliad]

23 hours ago, Rina_Pon said:

This is also useful. If I have this right, buying all three boosters means you only need to grind 16,000 instead of 55,000 points, and the event would end on Day 15, Christmas day. Coincidence I think not!

Also the first 3 directives has missions for the Gorizia, so if you want complete those even faster, you can buy the Gorizia first and can get back its cost in doubloons later once you complete directive 3. So for the price of Gorizia and 24,000 doubloons, you can get the Gorizia + 8,500 doubloons (see edit below) + Puerto Rico with a relatively stress free grind. Not including all those miscellaneous knick knacks along the way.

The key question though, is the Puerto Rico worth it? I would say only if you were planning to buy the Gorizia anyway and you had spare doubloons lying around. Your mileage may vary though.

 

Edit:

It is actually not indicated anywhere how many doubloons you will receive from the compensation. I estimated that figure from the base Gorizia bundle in the Premium shop which states 8,500 doubloons, but this figure varies from bundle to bundle. The real amount is likely to be lower.

Be warned!

[LawrenceXVIII]

21 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

The key question though, is the Puerto Rico worth it? I would say only if you were planning to buy the Gorizia anyway and you had spare doubloons lying around. Your mileage may vary though.

Ppl speculate the accuracy is not good even though its sigma is 2.2

[dejiko_nyo]

"relatively stress free" is a misnomer. It means a commitment of a few (4-5 hours) a day, and a substantial amount of money to assure you get it. Remember, even spending 24000 doubloons (a VERY sizeable investment) does not guarantee a ship unless you pay up the other time commitment. Factor in regardless in random or coop, it is going to just be filled with people playing selfishly to complete the directives, well, the experience is going to be miserable. 

So. No. Whatever earnings I get from the directives will just be a side bonus. 24000 doubloons is camo for FIVE T10s. 

As a sidenote, I am more disgusted of sizeable part of the community that is easily bribed by wg and their sweet-talk and have "easily forget" the crap they have dealt us in the past. It is this exact attitude that allows things like this to repeatedly happen because "Oh, the community will forget and it is business as usual."

[Mechfori]

I challenge the WG Staff to go do it themselves with a personal account, on the basis they had to do their normal work, had their normal life, need to tend to their normal family matters .. and do it without paying .. well that's what the wording say .. then prove it to us it can be done ...

I highly doubt any of them can do it

[Project45_Opytny]

23 minutes ago, LawrenceXVIII said:

Ppl speculate the accuracy is not good even though its sigma is 2.2

She uses the "ordinary" US battleship dispersion formula instead of the super cruiser one.

Though perhaps the combination of CB dispersion and 12-gun broadside would be too effective.

[Thyaliad]

12 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

"relatively stress free" is a misnomer. It means a commitment of a few (4-5 hours) a day, and a substantial amount of money to assure you get it. Remember, even spending 24000 doubloons (a VERY sizeable investment) does not guarantee a ship unless you pay up the other time commitment. Factor in regardless in random or coop, it is going to just be filled with people playing selfishly to complete the directives, well, the experience is going to be miserable. 

With 3 boosters you would only need to complete the first 3 directives (which also gives the Gorizia). Buying the Gorizia first makes those directives easier. If you don't think you can complete the 3 directives in time, then it may be hard for you to even get the Gorizia.

But like I said, your mileage may vary. As you noted, 15,500 doubloons (24,000 for 3 boosters - 8,500 for Gorizia compensation) is a lot of money. With the Armoury discount coupons, I can get 2 Tier 8 ships with that. Use 1 coupon for the first ship and wait for a new coupon and use it on another.

 

Edit:

It is actually not indicated anywhere how many doubloons you will receive from the compensation. I estimated that figure from the base Gorizia bundle in the Premium shop which states 8,500 doubloons, but this figure varies from bundle to bundle. The real amount is likely to be lower.

Be warned!

[Rina_Pon]

4 hours ago, Thyaliad said:

Also the first 3 directives has missions for the Gorizia, so if you want complete those even faster, you can buy the Gorizia first and can get back its cost in doubloons later once you complete directive 3. So for the price of Gorizia and 24,000 doubloons, you can get the Gorizia + 8,500 doubloons + Puerto Rico with a relatively stress free grind. Not including all those miscellaneous knick knacks along the way.

The key question though, is the Puerto Rico worth it? I would say only if you were planning to buy the Gorizia anyway and you had spare doubloons lying around. Your mileage may vary though.

Gorizia is Zara with no torps but hydro as compensation (edit: and faster smoke cooldown). That's a somewhat interesting twist, but hydro is of questionable benefit - based on my experience with Zara at least. 

Still, buying doubloons via a free Gorizia could well be the most intelligent approach to this event, ignoring the Puerto Rico entirely. If you are interested in buying 8500 doubloons I mean, might as well get a T7 cruiser out of it.

I'm curious about the extra mission you get if you buy the ship: "Tier VII Gorizia will also provide you with access to a chain of combat missions that once completed will reward you with four researchable Tier VI ships and two New Year permanent camouflage patterns." What four ships are they talking about? Researchable means tech tree right?

[Thyaliad]

28 minutes ago, Rina_Pon said:

I'm curious about the extra mission you get if you buy the ship: "Tier VII Gorizia will also provide you with access to a chain of combat missions that once completed will reward you with four researchable Tier VI ships and two New Year permanent camouflage patterns." What four ships are they talking about? Researchable means tech tree right?

I think those missions are already in your missions tab. You don't need to buy the Gorizia to access them, but it is needed for completing the first mission. Buying the Gorizia first just gives you a headstart and therefore less time pressure to complete them.

The four tech tree ships are Trento, Guepard, Izmail amd Furious.  Basically the Tier 6 ships of the lines that were released this year. They come fully researched and upgraded. If you have already them you will get their credits in compensation. 

More info can be found here:

https://worldofwarships.asia/en/news/sales-and-events/missions-0811/

 

[HobartAWD]

Just to let those know who were unaware, If you spend dubs and shipbuilding token to speed up the building process but the ship isn't completed at the end of one month they are gone. Lost to the digital ether that is the internet. In the case of dubs though straight to WG's exceeding full pockets. Extremely scummy move on WG's part. 

You can still buy the ship, but at the full cost of 35k dubs. Even if you are 95% through construction at the end of one month you will still need to pay 35k dubs and your dubs and shipbuilding tokens spent on boosters will have been for nothing.

So if you are going to spend the dubs, be darn sure you are going to be able to complete the required directives in order to ensure the ship will be completed.

Hate to see people waste up to 24k dubs and give them straight to WG's pockets, and not get the ship after all that time, money and effort invested.

This must be the Russian version of a Christmas present. You work towards receiving a gift (Puerto Rico) but even after spending many times its actual value, you still may not receive it at all. Reminds me of the "Russian refund" system regarding the preferential premium tanks in WOT when WG outlined their planned changes, and the storm that that created. 

 

[dejiko_nyo]

4 hours ago, HobartAWD said:

Just to let those know who were unaware, If you spend dubs and shipbuilding token to speed up the building process but the ship isn't completed at the end of one month they are gone. Lost to the digital ether that is the internet. In the case of dubs though straight to WG's exceeding full pockets. Extremely scummy move on WG's part. 

This is particularly one of the issues that people have issues with. You have spent 24k worth of hard cash and are not guaranteed to get the ship in the grind. Previous years was cash or grind; no "middle ground". 

[Thyaliad]

4 hours ago, HobartAWD said:

Just to let those know who were unaware, If you spend dubs and shipbuilding token to speed up the building process but the ship isn't completed at the end of one month they are gone. Lost to the digital ether that is the internet. In the case of dubs though straight to WG's exceeding full pockets. Extremely scummy move on WG's part. 

You can still buy the ship, but at the full cost of 35k dubs. Even if you are 95% through construction at the end of one month you will still need to pay 35k dubs and your dubs and shipbuilding tokens spent on boosters will have been for nothing.

So if you are going to spend the dubs, be darn sure you are going to be able to complete the required directives in order to ensure the ship will be completed.

Hate to see people waste up to 24k dubs and give them straight to WG's pockets, and not get the ship after all that time, money and effort invested. 

Imo the cost of instantly completing the Puerto Rico should decrease the closer the ship gets to completion. But I guess that doesn't earn enough money for WG.

But yes, for those who are still thinking of getting the PR, please look through the directives and think very carefully whether you will be able to complete them. Because once spend any money on doubloon boosters, you will have to commit yourself to completing the PR otherwise your money will go to waste. Since the boosters kick in the moment you activate them, any moment wasted not activating a booster you could have is wasted points and thus more work for you. The boosters will start once the ship begins building, which is about 1 day 6hrs from now at this point of writing, so please use the time to decide beforehand how many boosters you will want to activate.

Also if you are aiming for the PR, I highly suggest getting the Gorizia too. The Gorizia makes the first 3 directives a lot easier, plus the doubloon compensation you get after directive 3 while help  in recuperating some of the cost of the doubloon boosters.

[AxEyBoI]

IF you get the 3 boosts your going to have to complete the 5 directives lol not 3. Trust me, or WG .........time is against yous. Heres your presents comrades, a month in the Gulag, hope you have a comfy PC chair if not then ROFL cos you pay either way. To get that carrot your going to have to trade in your potato and pumpkin for it, except you give 1st and might not even get the carrot at the end of it. HAHA