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Paladinum

Your priorities are horrible, WG

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Your priorities suck, WG.

 

WarGaming: *took about a dozen Updates to buff FdG's reload, albeit the reload was horrible since release*

Also WarGaming: *added a sweeping mechanic in one day (0.8.5 AA change), addressing THE FOLLOWING DAY that they will adjust that quickly*

Sometimes WG's reaction is as fast as lightning (the natural phenomenon, not the DD), sometimes as fast as a snail crawling on tar.

:fish_palm: :fish_palm: :fish_palm: :fish_palm: :fish_palm: 

 

Edited by Paladinum
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Be careful though. WG may give a bad RNG after this.

The reason why they change the AA is because of the huge amount of players that still suffering from CVs. There are just more players that whining about the oddity of AA mechanics than buffing FDG. Balancing the mechanics really matters in the early phase of CV rework.

But okay I'm still agree with you. 

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well not the firs time, won't be the last time, let's be frank I do not trust WG to put things right , their track record made it highly unlikely ..  

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5 hours ago, Paladinum said:

*added a sweeping mechanic in one day (0.8.5 AA change), addressing THE FOLLOWING DAY that they will adjust that quickly*

Well what they've done is introduced the most massive single nerf to a ship class that I can recall.  They've also done it without actually announcing it before it hit the patch notes, unlike basically every other change they've done.

Now they've released it, the vast majority of the CV captains have gone 'nope' and either taken a break or played other classes, and the CV population has dropped to almost nothing.  WG have seen this and released they might have overdone it by a significant margin, and put out an announcement literally the day after the patch dropped (!) that they will be reviewing it over the weekend and will put out buffs early next week.  That's unheard of, even when 0.8.0 dropped they waited a week before announcing potential changes, and then the actual first hotfix came through nearly a week after that.  I think their actions now are probably a reflection of the seriousness of the issue.

The biggest issue is that they've basically thrown 5 months of AA balancing out the window.  AA was quite well balanced as of about 0.8.3 to 0.8.4, in terms of how well it mitigated damage taken from CV's, and now that balancing is gone.

Not to say they couldn't balance it now, they could up the plane health so the rate of planes being shot down was a bit slower, then buff the plane regen significantly to allow for the much higher plane losses.  This would mean a well played CV would still have a moderate amount of planes available, but surface ships would still be shooting planes down regularly, which would feel better for them than the previous iteration.  There are still plenty of new problems they've introduced with the change, but at least that would be roughly balanced.

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6 hours ago, Paladinum said:

Your priorities suck, WG. 

Nah, it is just you being biased towards German ships. :Smile_teethhappy:

Seriously though, this change is a much bigger issue and affects a lot more player than some FDG reload buff. This is probably the biggest CV change since the entire rework. It is a good thing that WG is keeping a close eye on its effects.

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And how are they going to "observe the changes over the weekend and collect their vaunted statistics" when all the CV captains have bailed?

I also noted the doublespeak: "we are not unnerfing the nerf but "adjusting things"" -_- That is still unnerfing the nerf to a degree. -_-

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Problem here is they change the AA to suite the vocal AA ship population but this change do nothing to deal with the more populous middle of the road surface ships and certainly not most of the light force ... so on one hand it might feel like a lot worse for CV player but on the other end the more common middle of the ground surface ships and most light force still feel like no counter play and no effective AA at all and those numbers I doubt could reflect that

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5 hours ago, Thyaliad said:

Nah, it is just you being biased towards German ships. :Smile_teethhappy:

Not bias! There are problems that have been there for a very long time, like +2/-2 MM, unfair team distribution (which I have been very vocal about), refusing to do anything to steer the game away from rewarding damage the most,...

and this current meta of who has better range wins.

Edited by Paladinum

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2 hours ago, Paladinum said:

and this current meta of who has better skills wins.

There fixed it. And not only in this meta but all other metas. It's just waste of time and money when you have a ship capable of sniping but you can't aim properly.

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2 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

There fixed it. And not only in this meta but all other metas. It's just waste of time and money when you have a ship capable of sniping but you can't aim properly.

Among people of equal skill, ships with better range win. And that becomes a horrible meta to anyone who wants any semblance of teamwork (aka winning consistently), ships designed for cqc, etc.

Edited by Paladinum

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5 hours ago, Paladinum said:

Among people of equal skill, ships with better range win. And that becomes a horrible meta to anyone who wants any semblance of teamwork (aka winning consistently), ships designed for cqc, etc.

So you want all sniper's range reduced to 15-20 km?

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53 minutes ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

So you want all sniper's range reduced to 15-20 km?

I want all guns to be ineffective at 20+ km. 

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1 hour ago, Paladinum said:

I want all guns to be ineffective at 20+ km. 

WG has done that with RU BB (except Slava). Now it's just the matter of adopting it into the other lines.

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1 hour ago, Paladinum said:

I want all guns to be ineffective at 20+ km. 

2/3rd maximum stated range.

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59 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

2/3rd maximum stated range.

(only for BBs)

Edited by Paladinum
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1 hour ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

WG has done that with RU BB (except Slava). Now it's just the matter of adopting it into the other lines.

I really really hope they do for those BBs meant to brawl.. 

But maybe spare Yamato and Montana? 

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1 minute ago, Darkworld_2015 said:

I really really hope they do for those BBs meant to brawl.. 

But maybe spare Yamato and Montana? 

Yamato especially, is very overpopulated. But if IJN BBs are adopting the RU BBs accuracy mechanic, WG need to buff the manouverability a little bit.

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3 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

Yamato especially, is very overpopulated. But if IJN BBs are adopting the RU BBs accuracy mechanic, WG need to buff the manouverability a little bit.

Then they will had to in cue course buff most cruiser so they stand a chance to fight which then all the DD will need to get buffed regarding stealth and ranging cause they are in due course facing even mightier foe ... I wager right now the Question is not whether certain or all BB need mechanism changed, its about what ship and what class of ship at current game play meta, and current specification actually able to play and play to perform with their current specification and unfortunately many are not , simply because their spec are still the same  as in the old old versions of the game , we have now BB wit secondaries that goto something like 11+ KM , game always had multiple Radar, CV and yet most DD, CL, CA, and BB are still in their specification as they were before the intro of all these ( or proliferation of them )

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11 hours ago, Mechfori said:

I wager right now the Question is not whether certain or all BB need mechanism changed, its about what ship and what class of ship at current game play meta, and current specification actually able to play and play to perform with their current specification and unfortunately many are not , simply because their spec are still the same  as in the old old versions of the game , we have now BB wit secondaries that goto something like 11+ KM , game always had multiple Radar, CV and yet most DD, CL, CA, and BB are still in their specification as they were before the intro of all these ( or proliferation of them )

German BBs suffers the most. While RU BBs can endure AP and HE spam longer and compensate those with super accuracy at medium ranges, German BBs CANNOT. I mean yes their secondaries are their main advantages. But even so, it can be destroyed by a couple of salvos from Conqueror and cruisers. But we can't just let Yamato, Montana, Republique, or Conqueror sniping from the back and farming damage. 

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*sigh*

Powercreep. Right now older ships that had "barely workable" mechanics have got the shafted. Like you said, @mr_glitchy_R, german bbs are the most profound example. When they first came out, their pro was taking damage in CQC combat, but guess what? Very few people are brave enough to CQC. Taking GK as the example, it NEEDS to get into range to be able to use its benefit. It never can because almost everything is faster than it. The only thing it can rely on is luck. To put it in a way, it is like a new mex (terribly slooow), but the saving grace is that it can hit fairly accurately from range. Give the NM legendary german dispersion and watch people complain like no tomorrow. On the other end of the spectrum you have the OP French cruisers. Can run like gallic chickens AND shoot back with impunity. Double strength OPness (oh wait, I've not even included the gun OPness). Flimsy armour is not an excuse to give it excessive strengths because RN CAs have worse armour and do not have speed advantages.

Interestingly Soviet BBs (experience from Kremlin) are balanced despite the inital wave of "OP hype". Kremlin is good as a bow tanker. HE is like pathetic against him. The key weakness is that if you get blindsided and show your broadside. BLAM. Multiple citadels. So how do you counter them? Either 1) force them to show broadside 2) sneak up and then broadside them or 3) maybe those annoying thingys that fly off from certain "maligned" ships?

To quote Yuro: "What we are needing is a rework of the player base"

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3 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

To quote Yuro: "What we are needing is a rework of the player base"

I agree, but the devs HAVE TO make damm sure players want to push, will push and they will be rewarded justly for getting close with the enemies. Sorrowfully, WG are deadset on rewarding damage dealing the most, as in their latest QnA stream about 2 days ago (that and +2/-2 MM, they will adjust that T8 ship will see T10 less, but still refuse to implement +1/-1 MM).

 

German ships suffer the most in many ways for a long time and WG seem to not give a poop about that. This is not an entire ship type, sure, but a whole nation in the game with 3 full ship lines. For solutions... read here. 

One of the best solutions I could think of is this:

Quote

The solutions for the ship's survivability can be quite simple: redistribute HP of the ship's parts (for cruisers and BBs). Make all other parts saturate damage quicker and focus the ship's HP in the citadel. If you can't hit the citadel, you can't reliably sink them. Repair Party for German cruisers and BBs can "heal" citadel damage more. Also make them less prone to catching fire or less fire damage/sec.

 

Also, holy poop, why the legendary upgrade for GK is something that DECREASES the main gun range??? 

Edited by Paladinum

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5 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

German BBs suffers the most. While RU BBs can endure AP and HE spam longer and compensate those with super accuracy at medium ranges, German BBs CANNOT. I mean yes their secondaries are their main advantages. But even so, it can be destroyed by a couple of salvos from Conqueror and cruisers. But we can't just let Yamato, Montana, Republique, or Conqueror sniping from the back and farming damage. 

That's exactly the point, the specification mentioned and then many like the 10KM torp on IJN torpedo boats , or the 40+ Knot on Soviet DD, or those fast HE spam on USS CL , and of course German BB secondaries .. they look good on spec but the game do not play out ... cause of all the game mechanics interplay .. we are seeing mostly game where engagements are more like 12 to 15KM for most then the said game basically exclude these ships from even performing as they are out ranged but yet WG is still saying all things fine. its fine for  those who can deal real damage from these distance and those with armor that can tank it ; yeah basically all the BB and higher tier CA / Super cruiser , and of course CV who put planes literally the whole map away from the ship .

Any of these handicapped ships who ever venture to try to get in range in turn get massively focus and cross fired as most likely they are not in a group push ( which is rare these days ) and die quick .. I know , seen it too many time whether its the DD, CL, or even CA and BB .. this create the situation where many would not push and thus Domination is yet pushed to yet even slower pace where its more about who can kill as quick as possible for pretty much first half of the game and then see who can weather the left over fire and cap the latter half. Standard mode is no better and even more encouraging these mid to long range duel since no one  had a need to PUSH to cap any more

And of course the game reward system thus generate a significant bitterness among many who see that their team play and play that benefit the team being further ignored through lack of any incomes from such vital actions as flank / AA protection, area denial, screening for torp etc ... and that further discourage people to play hard and push and stay at this mid to long range dueling, many a confrontation internally between team members is thus generated , I've been blamed so many time to say I am not going out but can a solo DD go out and survive these days with all the Radar and Planes and ... if the cruisers and BB refuse to tag along right behind to provide support ... I feel like disconnected with the team at times. And of course CV rework bring yet more long range and unavoidable spotting upon enemy's hand ( and still do even with latest changes )

I've said on another thread / post long ago that this is all about ranging, the game had now alienate a hugh portion of ships population so they can only choose to survive but doing nothing or go forward and be a martyr .. There are clearly ways to made things right and made things work for them if the game / WG refuse to return itself to the range as deemed specified as old, but of course I do not see WG doing that as that would put their OP ships ( aka premium ships ) on a level playing field against all other ships ( and ditto their lovable favorite of the moment , CV then Russian BB now ) ; they are clearly not after fairness in game by their action ... I welcome them to prove me wrong BY ACTION and made it all ships, each and every ships, ship type and ship class able to perform and perform well ( when player do play well ) and made it no one are specified to fail

Edited by Mechfori
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2 hours ago, Mechfori said:

And of course the game reward system thus generate a significant bitterness among many who see that their team play and play that benefit the team being further ignored through lack of any incomes from such vital actions as flank / AA protection, area denial, screening for torp etc

Actually, WG has focused BBs income with flanking. They should've also punish those who snipe in the back. But even so, rich players can still compensate their losses of income with real life money. They use those moneys to buy a premium stuffs or shiploads of credits and doubloons.

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51 minutes ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

But even so, rich players can still compensate their losses of income with real life money. They use those moneys to buy a premium stuffs or shiploads of credits and doubloons.

That doesn't matter. What counts is that the game should be designed and reward highly for teamplay. And this game isn't designed for that, albeit being a game in which all game modes are team vs team.

Edited by Paladinum
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