BUFF the AMERICAN BB line (MONTANA!!!)

[JYC_GTA]

Wargaming, you have made the American BB line unbearable to grind with low penetration, thin deck armor and thin citadel protection armor.

The MONTANA has the lowest penetration capability of all BBs. BUFF IT. In reality, even though it had 406mm caliber guns, the shells were heavy and as a result it had one of the highest penetration capability of all BBs throughout the world. WG just put the slow shell velocity and excluded the high penetration capability.
The MONTANA had 57mm deck armor. In game, it only has 37mm, which is very similar to infamously thin French BB armor.
The MONTANA had thicker citadel protection and torpedo protecton armor. In game, it has thinner protection armors than BBs like VLADIVOSTOK, REPUBLIQUE and supposedly flank-armor-weak-KREMLIN.

MONTANA can't penetrate couterpart BBs of other nation reliably even on the side while big guns like YAMATO, KREMLIN, REPUBLIQUE can penetrate it relatively reliably even from the front while angled for auto-bounce. 
Also, the HE shells of DDs and CAs penetrate too easily on the MONTANA and cause multiple fires often. While the MONTANA is suffering from multiple fires, HE pens and overmatching AP due to thin deck armor, the MONTANA's shells never seem to find its mark reliably, due to not-so-reliable gun accuracy and low penetration.
The side armor poses problems too. When every other nations' BBs pen the side of the MONTANA's side armor relatively easily, the MONTANA himself can't penetrate reliably.

 

WG, plz just buff at least one of these three: the DECK ARMOR, the PENETRATION CAPABILITY, the SIDE-ARMOR.

[LtDan_IceCream]

9 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

Wargaming, you have made the American BB line unbearable to grind with low penetration, thin deck armor and thin citadel protection armor.

The MONTANA has the lowest penetration capability of all BBs. BUFF IT. In reality, even though it had 406mm caliber guns, the shells were heavy and as a result it had one of the highest penetration capability of all BBs throughout the world. WG just put the slow shell velocity and excluded the high penetration capability.
The MONTANA had 57mm deck armor. In game, it only has 37mm, which is very similar to infamously thin French BB armor.
The MONTANA had thicker citadel protection and torpedo protecton armor. In game, it has thinner protection armors than BBs like VLADIVOSTOK, REPUBLIQUE and supposedly flank-armor-weak-KREMLIN.

MONTANA can't penetrate couterpart BBs of other nation reliably even on the side while big guns like YAMATO, KREMLIN, REPUBLIQUE can penetrate it relatively reliably even from the front while angled for auto-bounce. 
Also, the HE shells of DDs and CAs penetrate too easily on the MONTANA and cause multiple fires often. While the MONTANA is suffering from multiple fires, HE pens and overmatching AP due to thin deck armor, the MONTANA's shells never seem to find its mark reliably, due to not-so-reliable gun accuracy and low penetration.
The side armor poses problems too. When every other nations' BBs pen the side of the MONTANA's side armor relatively easily, the MONTANA himself can't penetrate reliably.

 

WG, plz just buff at least one of these three: the DECK ARMOR, the PENETRATION CAPABILITY, the SIDE-ARMOR.

*WG*

[Ryuuoh_DeltaPlus]

9 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

Wargaming, you have made the American BB line unbearable to grind with low penetration, thin deck armor and thin citadel protection armor.

The MONTANA has the lowest penetration capability of all BBs. BUFF IT. In reality, even though it had 406mm caliber guns, the shells were heavy and as a result it had one of the highest penetration capability of all BBs throughout the world. WG just put the slow shell velocity and excluded the high penetration capability.
The MONTANA had 57mm deck armor. In game, it only has 37mm, which is very similar to infamously thin French BB armor.
The MONTANA had thicker citadel protection and torpedo protecton armor. In game, it has thinner protection armors than BBs like VLADIVOSTOK, REPUBLIQUE and supposedly flank-armor-weak-KREMLIN.

MONTANA can't penetrate couterpart BBs of other nation reliably even on the side while big guns like YAMATO, KREMLIN, REPUBLIQUE can penetrate it relatively reliably even from the front while angled for auto-bounce. 
Also, the HE shells of DDs and CAs penetrate too easily on the MONTANA and cause multiple fires often. While the MONTANA is suffering from multiple fires, HE pens and overmatching AP due to thin deck armor, the MONTANA's shells never seem to find its mark reliably, due to not-so-reliable gun accuracy and low penetration.
The side armor poses problems too. When every other nations' BBs pen the side of the MONTANA's side armor relatively easily, the MONTANA himself can't penetrate reliably.

 

WG, plz just buff at least one of these three: the DECK ARMOR, the PENETRATION CAPABILITY, the SIDE-ARMOR.

[mr_glitchy_R]

10 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

The MONTANA has the lowest penetration capability of all BBs.

You haven't tried British BB AP do you? If you are struggling to do damage with it, why don't you use HE shells?

10 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

In game, it has thinner protection armors than BBs like VLADIVOSTOK, REPUBLIQUE and supposedly flank-armor-weak-KREMLIN.

It really doesn't matter. If WG buff the armor, it can still be citadeled. Russian BBs is even more vulnerable to citadel when showing their broadside.

10 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

MONTANA can't penetrate couterpart BBs of other nation reliably even on the side while big guns like YAMATO, KREMLIN, REPUBLIQUE can penetrate it relatively reliably even from the front while angled for auto-bounce.

Only YAMATO can overmatch your 32mm bow.

10 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

WG, plz just buff at least one of these three: the DECK ARMOR, the PENETRATION CAPABILITY, the SIDE-ARMOR.

You know what? Why don't you buff your skill instead?

[Sir_Feather]

10 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

MONTANA can't penetrate couterpart BBs of other nation reliably even on the side while big guns like YAMATO, KREMLIN, REPUBLIQUE can penetrate it relatively reliably even from the front while angled for auto-bounce. 

Uhh you said it yourself. Montana has the 2nd smallest caliber for a T10 BB (only bigger than Bourgogne). And giving Montana a specialized penetration will break the rules that WG follow when they design the ships. Sure WG actually has done something similar to the high tier US CA, but that was because they were less popular than their IJN counterparts. And the US BBs just got the improved heal & better rudder shift as 2-in-1 buffs.

[Gummilicious]

5 minutes ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

You know what? Why don't you buff your skill instead?

 

[Paladinum]

Montana, albeit being one of the two oldest T10 BBs in the game, stood along side Yamato as the ships that stand firm against powercreep. And Montana is better than Yamato on so many aspects.

She can stand her ground (or water) against any T10 BB. Citadeling any of them with ease, except GK which she will full pen to death.

So heck no, Montana does not need buff right now. Same as Des Moines.

 

German tech tree ships, on the other hand,...

[Gummilicious]

11 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

When every other nations' BBs pen the side of the MONTANA's side armor relatively easily, the MONTANA himself can't penetrate reliably.

sorry this is just plain rubbish

11 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

Also, the HE shells of DDs and CAs penetrate too easily on the MONTANA and cause multiple fires often

learn to use your damage control party (use when u got 2 fire on your ship or 1fire+1flood)

You got the longest on-action time damage control party and is UNLIMITED!!!

Spoiler

if u dare to use the non-premium damage control party, you had it coming.

 

[dejiko_nyo]

GK needs the buff more. Cannot hit anything reliably if not in CQC.

[mr_glitchy_R]

2 hours ago, Sir_Feather said:

And the US BBs just got the improved heal & better rudder shift as 2-in-1 buffs.

The heal buff were given to SC up to Iowa. AFAIK, Montana didn't get any buffs

1 hour ago, Gummilicious said:

 



Ah yes, the good old fun and engaging. I know, I know.

31 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

GK needs the buff more. Cannot hit anything reliably if not in CQC.

No no. FDG deserves even more.

[Paladinum]

19 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

GK needs the buff more. Cannot hit anything reliably if not in CQC.

The thing that is everpresent in this forum: the apparent lack of whining posts about the things that need to whine about and the massive excess of whining threads about things that do not need that much whining about (or sometimes the whines are completely baseless, like this thread). 

[mr_glitchy_R]

19 minutes ago, Paladinum said:

the apparent lack of whining posts about the things that need to whine about and the massive excess of whining threads about things that do not need that much whining about. 

Apparently, most people doesn't know what need to be complained about. Or do they? Because most people complains after having a bad game, a bad RNG, a bad day, etc. But some of us also think twice before being scolded by the forum even more. Really, is there such thing as reasonable complaints? 

[Frozen Hearth]

14 hours ago, JYC_GTA said:

 the American BB line unbearable to grind with low penetration

Say wut ?!?!

Iowa and Colorado are the most fun BBs I've ever grinded with the rare exception of NC, which was a bit of a pain in the neck. 

[dejiko_nyo]

1 hour ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

No no. FDG deserves even more.

Which and whatever. All I know is the German line feels very underperforming. Used to be king of secondaries, pushed into 2nd place by French. Tanking? Taken over by Soviet BB. Wait. You can't even tank properly because people don't like fighting up close and dirty. Throw in the vaunted "German dispersion" and they become meh.

32 minutes ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

Apparently, most people doesn't know what need to be complained about. Or do they? Because most people complains after having a bad game, a bad RNG, a bad day, etc. But some of us also think twice before being scolded by the forum even more. Really, is there such thing as reasonable complaints? 

 

1 hour ago, Paladinum said:

The thing that is everpresent in this forum: the apparent lack of whining posts about the things that need to whine about and the massive excess of whining threads about things that do not need that much whining about. 

+1 spot on cookies for you both. I think we have seen months of it since January. People don't even try to see or try the bigger picture. OR MAYBE it's the style people play. Of course you are unlikely to get good penetrations/hits if you sit at max range. Maybe people need to get up close and fight. Maybe your opponents learnt the art of bow tanking?

I really want to get a montana to comment more but at the moment, all my leftover lines are stuck at T8. (NC/Hipper/Z-23/Ognevoi/Kiev). Just no enthusiasm to grind at worst possible tier.

[RalphTheTheatreCat]

I wonder if OP is going to come back...…………………………...

[S4pp3R]

Unrivalled broadside, good AA, decent in most other regards, Montana is an all rounder, if you can't make her work I have some news for you... Even as recent as last year she was meta in CB...

So no - she is perfectly fine... USN has remained surprisingly strong against power-creep in general, player not ship issue...

[mr_glitchy_R]

2 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

All I know is the German line feels very underperforming. Used to be king of secondaries, pushed into 2nd place by French. Tanking? Taken over by Soviet BB. Wait. You can't even tank properly because people don't like fighting up close and dirty. Throw in the vaunted "German dispersion" and they become meh.

Generally I agree.

[TheAzure]

Well we could agree that german line are all underperforming

[SakamotoDesu]

Montana is fine. Meanwhile other USN BB is already good, remember previously they receive buff?

Have you ever play german line recently? or u just play USN BB and bad at it?

[Coccoro]

Hello

As one of the proud owner of USS Montana (or MONTANA x10 as per mentioned in your post - including 1 form topic) in this game, me my self didn't see any buff needed in certain parameter as per stated as in USS Montana is one of best all rounder BB in line.

I am sorry to state this but you only have slightly over 1.2k battles; maybe what you try to point here this USN line that you've been concentrate grinding and did not wanted to be cheated (?) by WG just because (maybe) that the ships are totally underperformed by your standard.

Just my 2 cents and hope all the best

[Paladinum]

Seems like the consensus is that the thread should change to "BUFF the GERMAN BB line (Großer Kurfürst!!!)"

[Paladinum]

17 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

Used to be king of secondaries, pushed into 2nd place by French.

The reload on the German double 150 mm secondary is a dam shame for ships that were advertised as "secondary-focused". 4s on the 128 mm is a shame too.

1/3 HE pen for all German secondary guns  now basically every German sec gun of 100 mm and up can pen 32 mm without IFHE 

And then comes the problem of secondary range. GK 7,8 km vs Repub 8 km. GK should get like 8,5. All other German BBs should get their sec range buffed as well.

I mean, giving German BB secondary 3.0 sigma and 50 m dispersion would work too... 

[dejiko_nyo]

28 minutes ago, Paladinum said:

Seems like the consensus is that the thread should change to "BUFF the GERMAN BB line (Großer Kurfürst!!!)"

Yes.

[Onlinegamer]

[Paladinum]

Also, air detection on GK is garbage compare to other T10 BBs.

Other T10 BBs: less than 11km air detection radius, even Yamato, Montana and Conqueror which are ALL taller
GK: 12 km
This is a horrible joke.

Also Hindenburg, Henri IV and Mockba have worse surface detection than Conqueror, which is much larger and taller AND is a BB?

 

On that note, Z-52. Newer than Gearing yet >almost< not as good as her. Grozovoi is basically Russian Z-52, but with Heal. The only T10 DDs that Z-52 would out fight in a gun duel is Yueyang and Shima. Yueyang got nerfed wrongly too, that torpedo reload nerf was stupid and gun reload nerf is utterly stupid.
Z-52 should get the same treatment as Gearing. A new Hull B module with torpedo with longer range - at least 12 km (and longer reload to match), and slightly different consumable set (trading Speed Boost for cruiser Heal).