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Rina_Pon

This is what happens when Mr. Red CV does not do his job.

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shot-19_05.08_02_36.33-0657.thumb.jpg.13ea13c1c5fa6cd4413d4ad4aafd6b94.jpg

First Kraken since the rework. In a CV game. With only a 6 pt captain (aka no CE).

TIL: While most DDs can't dodge rockets in 0.8.3 (this is planned to change in the next update) Hatsu is more maneuverable than most DDs, and that puts it just over the threshold when it stands even odds of the rockets missing. Plus it has credible AA against T6 planes. The enemy CV attempted to attack me a couple of times, but got frustrated because he lost planes and did no damage. He then made the critical error to go and farm his damage elsewhere rather than keep me spotted.

With somewhat predictable results, given that most of the rest of his team were ... inexperienced, to put it kindly.

I've always liked Hatsuharu, but I've had a number of great games in her recently. She seems to thrive in the new CV meta. She faces very few real threats at T5-7. It's only in T8 games that life gets hard.

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1 hour ago, Rina_Pon said:

shot-19_05.08_02_36.33-0657.thumb.jpg.13ea13c1c5fa6cd4413d4ad4aafd6b94.jpg

First Kraken since the rework. In a CV game. With only a 6 pt captain (aka no CE).

TIL: While most DDs can't dodge rockets in 0.8.3 (this is planned to change in the next update) Hatsu is more maneuverable than most DDs, and that puts it just over the threshold when it stands even odds of the rockets missing. Plus it has credible AA against T6 planes. The enemy CV attempted to attack me a couple of times, but got frustrated because he lost planes and did no damage. He then made the critical error to go and farm his damage elsewhere rather than keep me spotted.

With somewhat predictable results, given that most of the rest of his team were ... inexperienced, to put it kindly.

I've always liked Hatsuharu, but I've had a number of great games in her recently. She seems to thrive in the new CV meta. She faces very few real threats at T5-7. It's only in T8 games that life gets hard.

And once again, CV selfishness helps you. Despite the huge tactical advantage, with only 1 squad, CVs will often go pick on an easier target if they cannot hit you.

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1 hour ago, Grygus_Triss said:

And once again, CV selfishness helps you. Despite the huge tactical advantage, with only 1 squad, CVs will often go pick on an easier target if they cannot hit you.

Precisely this. Yes, sinking enemy ships wins games. But as a CV its very hard to win the game if you have no teammates left.

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the qustion is, what ship was he, if it was a RJ he will be far far more effective going after medium-large targets, instead of being a inefficient anti DD he could be a far more effective anti capital and destroy your team before you can out damage him, because remember, every unsuccessful strike he wastes on you, your CV is effectively getting damage with no pressure of needing to out damage him. 

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"CV job is to bully DD with rockets!"

Sometimes I think the youtube videos are more detrimental to gameplay than improving it.

People fail to:
1) Know their ship well enough on how to effectively use it.
2) Know their opponents well enough on how to effectively attack/not attack them.

It boils down to what we all are seeing in randoms, coop, scenarios, ranked: Lack of adaption to the current situation at hand.

This applies across classes and not just a particular one.

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1 hour ago, drakon233 said:

the qustion is, what ship was he, if it was a RJ he will be far far more effective going after medium-large targets, instead of being a inefficient anti DD he could be a far more effective anti capital and destroy your team before you can out damage him, because remember, every unsuccessful strike he wastes on you, your CV is effectively getting damage with no pressure of needing to out damage him. 

May have been Ryujo, I can't recall -  but it would have been sufficient to just keep me spotted from time to time, as they had a Myoko in play for most of the game.

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after a hardcore frustrated against CV rocket, I start to grasp how to doge them.

rocket require considerable distance to start on attack run, and once it start, they can't turn.

and that distance is 'greater' than DD air spotting distance (if AA is off)

meaning, he have to fly pass over DD once and out of spotting range than U-turn again to attack that DD, he have to memorize DD last know position, guess where that DD would be and start attack run 'blindly'

if that DD keep on predictable heading or stationary, he's in for a hurt. if that DD drastically change direction 'after' plane leave spotting distance, DD have advantage in dodging.

 

if CV commit to attack DD with rocket and that DD commit to dodge it... DD can mostly dodge rocket strike.

but that's mean DD have to abandon everything relate to surface combat to dodge it, his positioning, torpedo attack run etc....

 

I still can't figure out how to deal with Dive bomber though... they can start attack almost on top if every target and not a single surface ship fast enough do dodge that.

only pray to AA and RNG for DB....

 

Spoiler

my standing in CV matter still the same, they ARE balance breaker.

they NOT op but they break every balance in game.

 

Edited by PGM991
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12 minutes ago, PGM991 said:

after a hardcore frustrated against CV rocket, I start to grasp how to doge them.

rocket require considerable distance to start on attack run, and once it start, they can't turn.

and that distance is 'greater' than DD air spotting distance (if AA is off)

meaning, he have to fly pass over DD once and out of spotting range than U-turn again to attack that DD, he have to memorize DD last know position, guess where that DD would be and start attack run 'blindly'

if that DD keep on predictable heading or stationary, he's in for a hurt. if that DD drastically change direction 'after' plane leave spotting distance, DD have advantage in dodging.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

my standing in CV matter still the same, they ARE balance breaker.

they NOT op but they break every balance in game.

 

That sums up the whole reason why CVs (or rather US CVs) started to use DB instead of rockets against DDs after 0.8.3 hits live server. Even the slow British planes are still fast enough to fly pass the DDs without detecting them unless the DDs had their AA on all the time. IJN bombers except Kaga are ineffective against DDs while British bombers are pretty much "hit or miss" against DDs thanks to the linear drop pattern instead of small ellipse on US DBs.

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43 minutes ago, PGM991 said:

after a hardcore frustrated against CV rocket, I start to grasp how to doge them.

rocket require considerable distance to start on attack run, and once it start, they can't turn.

and that distance is 'greater' than DD air spotting distance (if AA is off)

meaning, he have to fly pass over DD once and out of spotting range than U-turn again to attack that DD, he have to memorize DD last know position, guess where that DD would be and start attack run 'blindly'

if that DD keep on predictable heading or stationary, he's in for a hurt. if that DD drastically change direction 'after' plane leave spotting distance, DD have advantage in dodging.

 

if CV commit to attack DD with rocket and that DD commit to dodge it... DD can mostly dodge rocket strike.

but that's mean DD have to abandon everything relate to surface combat to dodge it, his positioning, torpedo attack run etc....

 

I still can't figure out how to deal with Dive bomber though... they can start attack almost on top if every target and not a single surface ship fast enough do dodge that.

only pray to AA and RNG for DB....

 

  Reveal hidden contents

my standing in CV matter still the same, they ARE balance breaker.

they NOT op but they break every balance in game.

 

I wouldn't say you are abandoning your dd role by being a CV magnet and occupying the CV's attention. You just took CV pressure off your team. Now whether your team takes advantage of it is a different story. 

Anyhow, with 0.8.4 coming, I am glad WG is making DD more CV unfriendly as I have mentioned in the past.

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1 hour ago, PGM991 said:

after a hardcore frustrated against CV rocket, I start to grasp how to doge them.

rocket require considerable distance to start on attack run, and once it start, they can't turn.

and that distance is 'greater' than DD air spotting distance (if AA is off)

meaning, he have to fly pass over DD once and out of spotting range than U-turn again to attack that DD, he have to memorize DD last know position, guess where that DD would be and start attack run 'blindly'

if that DD keep on predictable heading or stationary, he's in for a hurt. if that DD drastically change direction 'after' plane leave spotting distance, DD have advantage in dodging.

 

if CV commit to attack DD with rocket and that DD commit to dodge it... DD can mostly dodge rocket strike.

but that's mean DD have to abandon everything relate to surface combat to dodge it, his positioning, torpedo attack run etc....

 

I still can't figure out how to deal with Dive bomber though... they can start attack almost on top if every target and not a single surface ship fast enough do dodge that.

only pray to AA and RNG for DB....

 

  Reveal hidden contents

my standing in CV matter still the same, they ARE balance breaker.

they NOT op but they break every balance in game.

 

That's what myself and some other members had been telling the community in past two months.

If you accepted it and have faith in other player's advice, put some effort into practice, you probably already figured out more way to play against CV.

Drakon was right about CV DB is other threads, pay attention on how many wave left in their squadron. If one wave left, you can jerk it, if full squadron then smoke and wait it out. 

CV have no patience, and their squadron can not stationary in one spot. The more time it exposed, the more meaningless AA damage will be taken. So, they will find the next target to drop their payload asap.

Also CV usually will test DD in the beginning of the match a couple of time. If you show them that you are capable and will waste their time in the beginning of the match, CV will most likely to leave you alone for the entire match.

Edited by sunlo2013

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2 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

It boils down to what we all are seeing in randoms, coop, scenarios, ranked: Lack of adaption to the current situation at hand.

This applies across classes and not just a particular one.

The adaption you refer to is learning to play as a cohesive unit, at least between teammates on a given flank.

On one hand I like the emphasis on teamwork.

On the other hand, battles are consequently more often lost rather than won. It's not which team has the best player, but which team has the worst player, that tends to decide the outcome. For a good player that means whether you win or whether you lose is less likely to be something you have influence over, and for me at least that's a big source of the frustration.

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3 hours ago, drakon233 said:

every unsuccessful strike he wastes on you, your CV is effectively getting damage with no pressure of needing to out damage him. 

Precisely this.

Every failed attack against you could have been a very successful attack agaist another teammate.

2 hours ago, PGM991 said:

grasp how to doge them.

rocket require considerable distance to start on attack run, and once it start, they can't turn.

and that distance is 'greater' than DD air spotting distance (if AA is off)

meaning, he have to fly pass over DD once and out of spotting range than U-turn again to attack that DD, he have to memorize DD last know position, guess where that DD would be and start attack run 'blindly'

if that DD keep on predictable heading or stationary, he's in for a hurt. if that DD drastically change direction 'after' plane leave spotting distance, DD have advantage in dodging.

Lol this is what I and others who have played CVs have been saying for ages.

That is why DDs with long AA range should turn off their AA when trying to avoid planes.

Yet too often I see DD players failing to heed this simple advice in-game.

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3 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

Precisely this.

Every failed attack against you could have been a very successful attack agaist another teammate.

Lol this is what I and others who have played CVs have been saying for ages.

Yes, we've been stating the obvious since the beginning yet there are those that refuse to listen. When we say "try playing that particular class", we mean for you to learn what the weaknesses are and how to take advantage of that weakness. Sadly, quite a number of people don't listen and rage blindly instead.

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53 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

Yes, we've been stating the obvious since the beginning yet there are those that refuse to listen. When we say "try playing that particular class", we mean for you to learn what the weaknesses are and how to take advantage of that weakness. Sadly, quite a number of people don't listen and rage blindly instead.

This is how I learnt to kill Myoko.

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8 minutes ago, Muds_Revenge said:

rockets are really bad on a lot of cvs so players won't even fly them.

no, just, no

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1 hour ago, Muds_Revenge said:

rockets are really bad on a lot of cvs so players won't even fly them.

I can only assume this is sarcasm or you just don't have a clue about CV's.

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