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UltimaBasti

Unlimited planes needs to change

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I really think this needs to be addressed. I understand why WG went with unlimited planes. So that CVs can still influence the fight late in the game rather than sailing around as target practice for every other type of ship. But here's the thing. Now CVs just don't care how many planes they lose. It's no problem to them. WG needs to tweak this so that losing planes become a sort of concern of r CV players. Otherwise, they stay in a far corner. Not afraid of their ship being shot at, and not caring that their planes are lost.

Now if you can't limit the number of planes CVs have, you should make it much harder for them to regenerate planes. The important thing is CVs should care about losing planes. It kinda gets stupid that I can shoot down 52 planes and they still just keep on coming.

 

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Untouchables
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Dear UltimaBasti, with all due respect, "unlimited planes" and "CV do not care about the losses" seems like a myth mostly supported by those who did not try CV after rework. From my personal CV experience and general observations, while technically the planes ARE unlimited, if you take heavy losses, you either start using sub-optimal squadrons, or fly out with incomplete number of planes, or both. And this really reduces your combat efficiency, like, a lot. I don't think I know a single CV player who does not care about plane losses. And we don't have any plans to change the current plane reserves mechanics, because it works like it should - as long as you live, you can fight, but if you take plane losses, your ability to fight suffers. That's fair IMO.

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I bet that you haven't even played the reworkes CVs. Have you tried playing them yourself because if you do, you'll know that CVs don't have unlimited planes. It is only theoretically unlimited because there's a regen time but if the CV player keeps losing his planes from AA defense, he will not be able to get full squadrons anymore because the regen time can't keep up with the number of planes lost. That means that he will spend the rest of the game with sub-optimal squadrons and that will lead to less damage dealt and less impact to the game. 

2 hours ago, UltimaBasti said:

Now CVs just don't care how many planes they lose. It's no problem to them.

Again, if you played CVs, you'll realize that it is not a "no problem" for the CV players.

Edited by desTraxeon
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This is ridiculous.  Carriers are now massively overpowered. They were problematic before but now they just completely unbalance the game for all the other ship types.  Keeping them overpowered until they run out of aircraft seems a much more reasonable approach.  Every other ship class has to be careful which other classes they attack or expose themselves to, why shouldn't there be a similar problem for carriers?

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Regardless of slow regen, CV will still have planes available they can use to attack anywhere regardless of cover and positioning. The argument of "well if too many gets shot down they have less planes" isn't really a good argument in my opinion because when surface ships take too many shots.... they blow up and guess what, they won't be able to contribute to the team AT ALL because they can no longer do damage. In my opinion, the current balancing still favors CV too much, as the pros of being able to constantly attack and spot the majority of the map at an exceedingly fast speed and be able to attack almost regardless of ship positioning far outweighs the cons of having to wait to regenerate planes.

Edited by I_am_stupid_so

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anyone who thinks carriers are massively overpowered should go and play them to see how OP they  really  are. HINT they're not. The above comment is so stupid it boggles  the mind.  It reminds me that most players areless intelligent than plants notably potatoes.

please look up the concept of taking damage and its causes being shot at.

And if you think planes can attack from any angle AA is a thing and and will often prevent entirely an attack  if it is concentrated enough  or if you're even 1 tier higher than the CVs planes in most cases.

Also it is possible to deplane a CV entirely all too easily if you manage to get your AA close to the ship itself though the ship is as good as sunk by that point most often

 

Edited by Moganite
missspell word any
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I've played against CV enough to know they still sustain damage, but in the end it doesn't affect CV players the same way getting damaged affects ship players. Also, getting deplaned entirely only happens when a CV player is unskilled. Playing high tiered games enough, you can really see that CVs almost always has a great effect on the game and will more often take top spot in team. Ones that don't are often times on the losing team. Not always, but more often. 

Planes cannot technically attack from any angle but they can move into range from any angle, not only to attack but to help spot. The one thing the old system had that made sense was to have limited planes, which required CV players to plan ahead before an attack or they lose all their planes in the end, kind of like how if surface ships don't plan an exit strat and charge in they get sunk. Right now though, not so much, just remember to avoid ship blobs.

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sorry all you good and not so good CV players, try telling me then why the hell the team which together had down literally hundreds of planes during a a game but yet at the end the planes still come on as if nothing happen ... when surface ships had unlimited ammo sure, they take damage when being shoot at ... CV practically take none if planes are down and the re spawn mechanism coupled with ineffective AA just made it so that the CV can spam attack without any real impact on its survival ... That's the main grip .. losing plane should made it so that CV take damage and that should couple with a more reasonable  re-spawn rate and might be even a check to that incomplete squadron should not be allowed to initiate. There are many solution to the issue on hand but thee is no denying there is this issue on hand ... and addressing does not mean taking this away always ... people be rational and don't try to made it look like its either all in or all out

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The reason people who feel like CV is OP is because they got solely focused by the carrier, but the fact is that focusing on one ship does not really contribute much to the team, and this affects the winning potential of the team. As a CV player, Kaga is the only premium CV I never considered buying because the mentality for having more low HP planes to throw at enemies is just so wrong. A good CV player would never enjoy dumping their planes to "annoy" a single player. If focusing a ship for multiple times is ineffective in sinking it, the CV player might as well consider bringing their attention to other ships, unless no other ships are in place.

Plane HP and regeneration are the distinct characteristics to distinguish between CVs like Saipan and Enterprise. Without this, they are basically the same CV.

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On 3/14/2019 at 2:27 PM, Sub_Octavian said:

Dear UltimaBasti, with all due respect, "unlimited planes" and "CV do not care about the losses" seems like a myth mostly supported by those who did not try CV after rework. From my personal CV experience and general observations, while technically the planes ARE unlimited, if you take heavy losses, you either start using sub-optimal squadrons, or fly out with incomplete number of planes, or both. And this really reduces your combat efficiency, like, a lot. I don't think I know a single CV player who does not care about plane losses. And we don't have any plans to change the current plane reserves mechanics, because it works like it should - as long as you live, you can fight, but if you take plane losses, your ability to fight suffers. That's fair IMO.

so ever considered the fact that ship's turrets/torpedo tubes/AA armaments being permanently destroyed should be changed? because for ships like Richelieu, Jean Bart, Dunkerque, Graf Spee and DDs completely depend on them to deal damage.. So In your opinion is it fair for them?

you can in the end come up with all kinds of word wizardary but having a chance of your armaments being permanently going out of commission vs something that always has a chance of regenerating it's armaments is NOT FAIR..

I'm not even gonna go into the details of AI controlled AA vs Human controlled planes..

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On 3/14/2019 at 1:01 PM, UltimaBasti said:

The important thing is CVs should care about losing planes. It kinda gets stupid that I can shoot down 52 planes and they still just keep on coming.

Well here I got a couple of examples for you

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shot-19.04.13_19.49.53-0066 - Copy.jpg

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So I came up against a Midway with a pretty interesting strategy once again, working around the imbalance of the CVs. He'd send a rocket squadron out. Drop a salvo quick. With the remaining planes do a run on me (I was using a semi AA Hindy: BFT, AA mod 1, Fighter planes). Then I guess he'd press the F key and go away. I dealt something like 51k damage to planes in that game but only got 4 plane kills. I'm not sure how he configured himself. I'm guessing speed boosts and armor, because once he pressed F, a new squadron would be on me again in 20 secs. And it was just that repetitive mind numbing consistent 6 to 7k damage that I can do absolutely nothing about. 

I wanted to give this rework a chance. I was honestly excited when the initial WIPs were showing on the CC channels. But damn, this is just broken. DD play has been crapped on. BBs can't do nothing. CAs are easy pickings, even the ones with supposedly great AA. I have nothing to suggest. Playing against CVs just isn't fun. 

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Ditching a squadron is common practice for cv players for the first part of the game as a plane conservation strategy 

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