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Mechfori

how do you deal with selfish CA / Cl player ... just a rant

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Had to vent this out ... just play a game this morning 12 vs 12 5Bb + 7 cruiser a side ( almost all CL with only 3 CA total ) on the Map Estuary on a domination game mode, starting disposition is normal ; right from start the cruisers on the west and center except one rush flank speed to east despite all the pleading to balance and keep the flank and at least one center to guard ... the guys just would not listen, even worse I got a reply from one of them " this is the way I play " I was on a BB and all I can do is watch them all 6 speed to one side then all hide behind island unable to even get out to spot and not to say capping when the other side is all suppressed by enemies cause we have only 1 cruiser there. And in the end those cruisers got themselves killed even faster. Ironically the game is a Victory despite all that

Is this the way cruiser captain these days do, just all their own , never bother to need to support or even care about the whole situation .. made long story short I made myself a TK that game ( only damage deal not really killing the guy )  ; I am not sorry for that 2 game penalty is worth it this time ...

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Well, you are playing on worst server. Unfortunately this is the outcome when scoring is biased towards direct damage instead of support. 

I've given up on wg doing things that will improve the game.

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12 minutes ago, dejiko_nyo said:

Well, you are playing on worst server.

Asia is the worst server? seriously how???

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8 minutes ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

Asia is the worst server? seriously how???

its ASIA what do you expect, almost every Asian server are like that. They won't listen because ''il play what i feel like the best'' and ended up screwing the team.

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11 minutes ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

Asia is the worst server? seriously how???

its asia. lots of its players dont speak english

also to OP

get use to it.jpg

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4 minutes ago, Hesa_ said:

its ASIA what do you expect, almost every Asian server are like that. They won't listen because ''il play what i feel like the best'' and ended up screwing the team.

yes, because 90% of the playerbase is not worth helping

 

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well well might be this old guy still had some heart , I do think even bad player deserve support, after all its a team play game .. so long the guy / gal are playing and contributing o matter ow little. The only ones whose not worth supporting is those guys whose out for his / her own only but unfortunately these days there are plenty of such .. BB and CA that runs the first instance enemies how up in range , and left the up front CL and DD fry, or DD who would not smoke for the team, Cl that stay way way out until everything sorted out then they come in to farm and steal damage. CV that send plane to no where cause they only care about how many kill the can get ... you can name the list and it all goes on and on.

I cannot count how many time I die in a ship supporting but I am not regretting any .. when I see a fellow member needing help I help at best I can .. I've seen too many that would reap the benefit of an advantageous situation but turn and run as quick and as fast as they could once situation start to turn sour or even just not going positive

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I rest my case with the testimonials.

I have lost count of the times we would have won if we just hid but no; some idiot wants to farm instead and we threw the game.

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@MechforiA clanmate showed me a replay of an unnamed player who I immediately recognized from their terrible playstyle in their frequent T8 premium ship in coop. He was playing random and was just equally as bad as he was in coop. Just only spewing more Fx keys for help while not doing his shimakaze job.

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hmmm. Many players do not know how to play in a game without DDs. Ideally, CL's with good concealment start acting as DDs, and BBs feel safer, so push more. But at the same time, CL's also get very scared when there are 5 or more BBs per side, only takes one lucky shot, from almost any angle, to lose half your health. Ideally, BBs come up to the cruiser line, allowing CL's to use them as cover while ducking and weaving between island cover while trying to keep guns firing at enemy.

All going one flank though... It a workable tactic, but the more successful one is either a 50/50 split, or a 60/40 split, where the weaker side goes defensive and delaying tactics. But it all boils down to individual player skill and luck and if you can start sinking the enemy ships.

I feel many CA/CLs are cowards because weak armor (or not really knowing how to play). They play to survive first, myself included I suppose. If a team decides to lemming train, not much you can do other than follow. Be happy it wasn't in standard battle.

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1 hour ago, yansuki said:

its asia. lots of its players dont speak english

also to OP

get use to it.jpg

HD version

you-get-used-to-it-37277870.png.5583bf424045303eb202ec6bfc495c7c.png

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1 hour ago, dejiko_nyo said:

Well, you are playing on worst server. 

Have you played on NA??????????????????????????

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hello haro

Its weekend

Random transforms to Rant-dumb :cap_haloween:

my defeat record 10 lost before 1 win :fish_boom:

Edited by MatterCore
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Nah, PTS worst server :Smile_trollface: (seriously, some seem to have NO situational awareness, some can't even aim)

 

The reason why cruiser players are afraid of BBs (being one, I know, but I'm not normal either), even more so for most US/IJN/VMF cruisers and CLs in general. If they can't spot, they have to rely on DDs (which, surprise surprise, are afraid of enemy (radar) cruisers), which creates the situation where a whole flank just dances around cap and cannot push at all.

But WG just can't seem to be able to bring themselves to limit the number of BBs per team. The "standard" number of BB per team is 5, and for DD is 2 - 4. How many cruisers can there be? Don't blame cruisers for saying they're afraid (of BBs). Blame them when they play like sh*t and don't even use their radar.

 

Yes I'm salty about how (OP) BBs are in this game. I blame all problems in this game on BBs and their mains :cap_haloween:

Edited by Paladinum
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there's nothing more selfish than battleship players who sit at maxrange, snipping target, hopping RNG will give them big hit. i all ship (except CV, not anymore after all of those bugs). i always support dd, giving them radar and trying to kill opposing dd. while bb just sit at the back as you tank all the agro of enemy bb's. half of time i got lots of damage from all of the agro i receive from enemies. while your bb allies are sitting comfy behind the back.

there are always that 1-2 bb per game that has full HP after 15min mark. while the rest of his team mates are dying. you cant blame CL and CA player. if they get selfish after all those years of getting punching back because allied bbs are too afraid, cuz enemies might scratch their painjob. that so horrible.

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8 minutes ago, yansuki said:

while your bb allies are sitting comfy behind the back.

Me when border-sniping BBs blame cruisers for being selfish:

1801296990_facepalmsgfjkhgkj.gif.0f3c85cc16aefbb82e7f60a7b35e2db9.gif

Edited by Paladinum
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I despise selfish player no matter what kind of ship he/she might be in , too bad this is more common place these days

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On ‎1‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 7:37 PM, Mechfori said:

I despise selfish player no matter what kind of ship he/she might be in , too bad this is more common place these days

You can blame that on social values where people believe you have to have the best and shiniest things and get them at any cost.

Edited by RalphTheTheatreCat
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All players act selfishly no matter what class they are. DDs refuse to spot, CAs and CLs refuse to support the DDs while BBs camp in the back. Then nobody supports each other and they lose. Then because they lose they don't see the point of supporting the team and just play even more selfishly, and they lose even more.

It is a death spiral.

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3 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

All players act selfishly no matter what class they are. DDs refuse to spot, CAs and CLs refuse to support the DDs while BBs camp in the back. Then nobody supports each other and they lose. Then because they lose they don't see the point of supporting the team and just play even more selfishly, and they lose even more.

It is a death spiral.

it is true .. indeed ; in actual game play this really come down to only 2 points, A: getting as much damage output possible, wile B: not getting hit by any means. Both of which contribute, the former lead to people caring only their damage farming to the point of ignoring everything else, the latter manifest in back seat driving by so many who simply will not engage unless its absolutely favorable, and when they do they revert to the state as mentioned on former point. As someone had put it, support had every drawback with no real reward. in practice its more like negative reward ( you help out you are targeted and then you receive loads of damage yourself )

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imo WG should give more rewarding credits and for anyone who do teamwork. e.g spotting. tanking damage and capping points and not just pure damage and kills. the reason why most player are selfish is because there is not much rewarding for spotting, tanking and capping. its not that rewarding specially you got killed in trying to help your team.

there are games were i tank more than 2m damage but still got mediocre exp. or a game with my dd where i got red for trying to spot enemy dd, i have to lay low only use my torp and do spotting. getting me close to 100k spotting damage and again, i got mediocre exp combined with damage exp.

instead of punishing players who dont participate and nerf damage exp, why not reward players who actually participate in team-play. by buffing spotting, tanking exp and capping. that way player has more initiative on doing teamplay.

why not add more achievement:
2m potential damage achievement (flag reduce repair cost of ship by 15%)
100k spotting damage (flag increase concealment by 3%)
3 assist/capture (flag increased speed by 5% dont stack with double strike flag)
10 cap reset.
more than 50 torpedo spotted for surface ship and 100 for cv. (increase torpedo acquisition range by 5%)
5 enemy killed while spotted by radar. (flag extend duration of AA,radar and sonar consumable  by 5% )

Edited by yansuki
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3 hours ago, Paladinum said:

Nah, PTS worst server :Smile_trollface: (seriously, some seem to have NO situational awareness, some can't even aim)

 

The reason why cruiser players are afraid of BBs (being one, I know, but I'm not normal either), even more so for most US/IJN/VMF cruisers and CLs in general. If they can't spot, they have to rely on DDs (which, surprise surprise, are afraid of enemy (radar) cruisers), which creates the situation where a whole flank just dances around cap and cannot push at all.

But WG just can't seem to be able to bring themselves to limit the number of BBs per team. The "standard" number of BB per team is 5, and for DD is 2 - 4. How many cruisers can there be? Don't blame cruisers for saying they're afraid (of BBs). Blame them when they play like sh*t and don't even use their radar.

 

Yes I'm salty about how (OP) BBs are in this game. I blame all problems in this game on BBs and their mains :cap_haloween:

Yeah, I really feel that 5 BBs are too many, especially if there are 4 DDs and only 3 Cruisers who are so scared to stick their necks out because BBs will prioritize them, and ally BBs stay back because scared of DDs.

3 hours ago, yansuki said:

there's nothing more selfish than battleship players who sit at maxrange, snipping target, hopping RNG will give them big hit. i all ship (except CV, not anymore after all of those bugs). i always support dd, giving them radar and trying to kill opposing dd. while bb just sit at the back as you tank all the agro of enemy bb's. half of time i got lots of damage from all of the agro i receive from enemies. while your bb allies are sitting comfy behind the back.

there are always that 1-2 bb per game that has full HP after 15min mark. while the rest of his team mates are dying. you cant blame CL and CA player. if they get selfish after all those years of getting punching back because allied bbs are too afraid, cuz enemies might scratch their painjob. that so horrible.

When I play BBs, I usually lose significant health to HE damage in first 7 minutes cause I try to get in close to support cruisers and DDs. Its HE, so I can heal most of it back, but it does mean I may need to retreat a bit while I heal up.

 

3 hours ago, Paladinum said:

Me when border-sniping BBs blame cruisers for being selfish:

1801296990_facepalmsgfjkhgkj.gif.0f3c85cc16aefbb82e7f60a7b35e2db9.gif

Hypocrisy knows no bounds. CV rework will hopefully deliver justice when CVs target lone BBs sitting at the back.

2 hours ago, Mechfori said:

I despise selfish player no matter what kind of ship he/she might be in , too bad this is more common place these days

All players will be selfish out of necessity at some point. That is, they will put their own survival first, mostly because many captains work on the theory, "you can't win if you're dead" And a living ship on 10% health who has run to the other side of the map is still more useful than a dead ship. If only because you would have lost points if he were dead. Not everyone has the skill to weave between shells with 1 HP and kill enemy, or even stand their ground against an equal ship with equal health. If you know you don't have the skill to win and survive, you really have to ask "what is the best thing I can do for my team now?"

1 hour ago, Thyaliad said:

All players act selfishly no matter what class they are. DDs refuse to spot, CAs and CLs refuse to support the DDs while BBs camp in the back. Then nobody supports each other and they lose. Then because they lose they don't see the point of supporting the team and just play even more selfishly, and they lose even more.

It is a death spiral.

While some players are just selfish for the sake of being selfish, some are just scared.

BBs: Scared of Torpedos; HE spam; Bow on Yamasashi; Planes.

CLs: Scared of BBs and being spotted.

CAs: Scared of BBs and any spam.

DDs: Scared of CAs; CLs; Secondary BBs; radar; hydro; planes; gunboat DDs (IJN line only)

To properly teamplay, you must recognise and neutralise these threats so your team can stop being scared/selfish and do their job.

If they still act selfish, I.e. No DDs in game and BBs still stay back and snipe, can't help with that, that's just selfishness.

1 hour ago, Mechfori said:

it is true .. indeed ; in actual game play this really come down to only 2 points, A: getting as much damage output possible, wile B: not getting hit by any means. Both of which contribute, the former lead to people caring only their damage farming to the point of ignoring everything else, the latter manifest in back seat driving by so many who simply will not engage unless its absolutely favorable, and when they do they revert to the state as mentioned on former point. As someone had put it, support had every drawback with no real reward. in practice its more like negative reward ( you help out you are targeted and then you receive loads of damage yourself )

I occasionally feel like that when I play Bismarck. I'll move slowly forward, My presence and secondaries are good at pushing enemy back, and allies will often start following me as I push. I might only end up with low damage, but I was a strong contributor in the advance. But do I get rewarded for it? Nope.

Myself, depending on what I'm driving, I'll play for survival first, then trying to contribute to a win, then damage. Often, especially if in a CL, this means just trying to survive while waiting for an opportunity to exploit, such as a BB in the open, or  supporting a team mate in a BB who decides its time to push. Its only if the situation is dire that I should start taking risks.

34 minutes ago, yansuki said:

imo WG should give more rewarding credits and for anyone who do teamwork. e.g spotting. tanking damage and capping points and not just pure damage and kills. the reason why most player are selfish is because there is not much rewarding for spotting, tanking and capping. its not that rewarding specially you got killed in trying to help your team.

there are games were i tank more than 2m damage but still got mediocre exp. or a game with my dd where i got red for trying to spot enemy dd, i have to lay low only use my torp and do spotting. getting me close to 100k spotting damage and again, i got mediocre exp combined with damage exp.

instead of punishing players who dont participate and nerf damage exp, why not reward players who actually participate in team-play. by buffing spotting, tanking exp and capping. that way player has more initiative on doing teamplay.

why not add more achievement:
2m potential damage achievement (flag reduce repair cost of ship by 15%)
100k spotting damage (flag increase concealment by 3%)
3 assist/capture
10 cap reset.
more than 50 torpedo spotted for surface ship and 100 for cv.
5 enemy killed while spotted by radar. (flag extend radar duration by 10% and radar range by 5%)

Not bad ideas, though not sure about the flags.

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5 minutes ago, Grygus_Triss said:

When I play BBs, I usually lose significant health to HE damage in first 7 minutes cause I try to get in close to support cruisers and DDs. Its HE, so I can heal most of it back, but it does mean I may need to retreat a bit while I heal up.

Works for my AR FdG. At 60% HP it's slapping time.

5 minutes ago, Grygus_Triss said:

I'll move slowly forward, My presence and secondaries are good at pushing enemy back, and allies will often start following me as I push.

I do try to frequently push forward in my BBs, sometimes that works, sometimes I sink alone.

 

42 minutes ago, yansuki said:

why not add more achievement:
2m potential damage achievement (flag reduce repair cost of ship by 15%)
100k spotting damage (flag increase concealment by 3%)
3 assist/capture
10 cap reset.
more than 50 torpedo spotted for surface ship and 100 for cv.
5 enemy killed while spotted by radar. (flag extend radar duration by 10% and radar range by 5%)

I like it, but like Gryrus, not the (new) signal flags. No more buffs to radar please.

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Teamwork is all but unknown to most players on this server. 

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33 minutes ago, Stormcloak_Rebel said:

Teamwork is all but unknown to most players on this server. 

What you have to do is predict what your team mates are going to do, then take advantage of it.

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