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PunishedKAsual

Massive planned changes on Flooding Mechanics

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Link to official information release https://medium.com/@devblogwows/radar-flooding-c8711f9e87a7

"Please note that the information in the Development Blog is preliminary."

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https://medium.com/@devblogwows/radar-flooding-c8711f9e87a7

 

Please note that the information in the Development Blog is preliminary.

Flooding changes

1*T77qNwOnaR7Rgp0funUZsQ.jpeg

The new flooding mechanics will be implemented similar to those of fire mechanics:
- The ship can suffer two floodings: on the stern and on the bow.
- Flooding cannot be inflicted on a part of the ship that is already flooding.

The flooding duration without modifiers has been reduced:
- 30 seconds remain for CVs;
- from 90 to 40 seconds for other classes.

The rate of hit points loss with one flooding has been reduced:
- from 0.667% to 0.25% per second for CVs;
- from 0.667% to 0.5% per second for battleships and Kronshtadt, Stalingrad, Azuma and Alaska cruisers;
- from 0.667% to 0.25% per second for cruisers and destroyers;
- from 0.667% to 0.375% per second for Admiral Graf Spee and HSF Admiral Graf Spee.

Flooding will reduce the power of the engine of any ships, when moving forward by 30% and when moving back by 60%.

For example, British Conqueror BB gets flooding in the bow because it’s hit by torpedo:
- Pre-rework flooding would cause ~49 800 damage if it is not stopped;
- New flooding would cause much less damage ~ 16600;
- Two simultaneous floodings would still cause less damage ~33 200.

As for cruisers and DDs, flooding damage goes down even further for them. Let’s see Kagero for example:
- Pre-rework flooding would cause up to ~9 000 damage, probably killing partially damaged ship:
- New flooding takes around ~1500 damage.

These changes will make flooding less painful for new players and will allow experienced players more efficient usage of the ship’s combat capability. Flooding will cause less damage to cruisers and destroyers. However, it will still be extremely dangerous for them, as the reduced power of the engine will greatly affect the survival of these classes of ships.

https://medium.com/@devblogwows/radar-flooding-c8711f9e87a7

 

So apparently Wargaming is planning a massive overhaul to the flooding mechanics.

I'm not sure whether this is a good direction or not. For torpedo-based ships at least. 

What do you guys think?

Edited by 9mm1n
chaged formatting for easier reading

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well, it depends on what it entails.

Less flooding? Then sure, not good for any torpedo based action.

But wouldn't it be cool if the changes included ships listing. Ohhh, to see a BB slowly heeling over, even with about 1/5 of its HP still left, a wounded beast dying.....

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Rediculous. All those proposed changes are dumb.

Its hard enough to get torp hits with all the hydro and now you arent even rewarded for them if you are lucky enough to flood them?

The proposed radar changes are also dumb with all the increased range changes.

Why do they have to make such big changes to things that dont need it? A couple small radar changes would fix the problem....

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Well, considering that after CV rework, there will be ridiculous amount of DoTs, this may be the only way to go about flooding. IMO this will probably be one of the best changes introduced to the game in recent times alongside BB AP adjustment on DDs:Smile_honoring:

Edited by _TAMAL_

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Well with the CV rework, a change to flooding mechanics is needed.

But this is a straight up nerf for any kind of DD that is reliant on torpedoes. The reduced engine power thing already exists for current flooding mechanics - WG is just trying to hype up this fact to prevent this change from looking like a complete nerf.

I don't mind this change but this cannot happen in a vacuum. Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs, which will already be hammered hard in the CV rework.

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2 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs,

Reducing detectability of IJN torps? Increasing range of German torps? :Smile_hiding:

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12 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs, which will already be hammered hard in the CV rework.

Agreed. Increasing the alpha slightly can be an easy and reasonable solution.

Other options include increasing speed of torps or adjusting the spotting range.

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1 hour ago, Thyaliad said:

Well with the CV rework, a change to flooding mechanics is needed.

But this is a straight up nerf for any kind of DD that is reliant on torpedoes. The reduced engine power thing already exists for current flooding mechanics - WG is just trying to hype up this fact to prevent this change from looking like a complete nerf.

I don't mind this change but this cannot happen in a vacuum. Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs, which will already be hammered hard in the CV rework.

Agreed.

I can understand the changes if you have more CVs around putting flooding dots on everyone. Fire spam from HE ships is bad enough, but torpedo spam from CVs. First drop, cause flood, wait 30 secs, drop again, cause another flood. Problem waiting to happen.

But its just another blow for torpedo boats, ESPECIALLY the IJN line. Yes, they have had buffs recently to guns, but they are still primarily torpedo boats.

So while I can agree with the changes to flooding, something must be done to buff ships which rely heavily on torpedos.

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4 hours ago, dieselhead said:

Its hard enough to get torp hits with all the hydro and now you arent even rewarded for them if you are lucky enough to flood them?

"These changes will make flooding less painful for new players."

Don't you see there are many new players being frustrated from flooding?

2 hours ago, Grygus_Triss said:

I can understand the changes if you have more CVs around putting flooding dots on everyone. Fire spam from HE ships is bad enough, but torpedo spam from CVs. First drop, cause flood, wait 30 secs, drop again, cause another flood. Problem waiting to happen.

^This.

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3 hours ago, Thyaliad said:

Well with the CV rework, a change to flooding mechanics is needed.

But this is a straight up nerf for any kind of DD that is reliant on torpedoes. The reduced engine power thing already exists for current flooding mechanics - WG is just trying to hype up this fact to prevent this change from looking like a complete nerf.

I don't mind this change but this cannot happen in a vacuum. Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs, which will already be hammered hard in the CV rework.

Agreed with your points. Personally I won't  even dare to play DD once 0.8.0 hits the live server. Heck I even delayed my grind for IJN DD. (I'm very average in DD gameplay)

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27 minutes ago, Darkworld_2015 said:

Agreed with your points. Personally I won't  even dare to play DD once 0.8.0 hits the live server. Heck I even delayed my grind for IJN DD. (I'm very average in DD gameplay)

You and a lot of other DD players. I mean why would you when the meta is such trash for DD's now?

 

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8 hours ago, Thyaliad said:

Well with the CV rework, a change to flooding mechanics is needed.

But this is a straight up nerf for any kind of DD that is reliant on torpedoes. The reduced engine power thing already exists for current flooding mechanics - WG is just trying to hype up this fact to prevent this change from looking like a complete nerf.

I don't mind this change but this cannot happen in a vacuum. Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs, which will already be hammered hard in the CV rework.

*looks at the planned radar buff. :cap_old:

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Well planes will not be able to detect torps anymore so that's one passive buff to torp DDs. Is it enough to compensate, I don't know though.

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Quote

These changes will make flooding less painful for new players and will allow experienced players more efficient usage of the ship's combat capability. Flooding will cause less damage to cruisers and destroyers. However, it will still be extremely dangerous for them, as the reduced power of the engine will greatly affect the survival of these classes of ships.

Flooding was once a much bigger issue than it is now, since carriers at higher tiers are so rare these days.

In fact, I would go so far to say that the only time flooding mechanics is relevant now is T4-5 matchmaking when each side has 2 CVs and you are in a battleship, maybe a Myogi or Kongo with no AA and no turning ability. You don't have premium consumables, and its pretty easy for the pair of enemy CVs to land multiple strikes.

When/if 8.0 drops and we enjoy World of Warplanes (& Some Warships) all bets are off however.

Edited by Rina_Pon

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On 1/26/2019 at 6:24 PM, Thyaliad said:

Well with the CV rework, a change to flooding mechanics is needed.

But this is a straight up nerf for any kind of DD that is reliant on torpedoes. The reduced engine power thing already exists for current flooding mechanics - WG is just trying to hype up this fact to prevent this change from looking like a complete nerf.

I don't mind this change but this cannot happen in a vacuum. Something needs to be done to raise the effectiveness of torpedo DDs, which will already be hammered hard in the CV rework.

I'm not entirely convinced that a change of this gravity to the flooding mechanics itself is necessary. 

While we all witness the damage potential of CVs after the rework goes through, I found the said mechanics changes a tad too punishing, and unsolicited, for Torpedo-based destroyers. Since the said changes are made necessary by the new CV-gameplay, the scope of the changes, affecting all the torpedo weapons in game, is simply to wide. A changes of this scale and gravity, driven simply because of the change of one class of ships, is unfair to others particularly to destroyer players. If the developers are concerned with the prospect of CVs dealing too much floodings and subsequently flooding damage, the logical step would be to limit flooding damage potential from aerial torpedos, instead of nerfing all the flooding damage across the board.

On another note, I seriously suspect counter-changes (if any) for Torpedo DDs, as suggested by some of our fellows, will only lead to more inter-class/ inter-ship balancing issues. To introduce a massive change to mechanics, only to introduce more changes in an attempt to compensate some of the affected, is just a voyage further down the the rabbit hole.

Edited by 9mm1n

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well if they buff the radar, and nerf the flooding they had to mde a significant buff to DD, especially torpedo boats ability to inflict damage ... its now 0.667% for 90 sec and new one 40 sec for at best 0.5 and worst 0.25% .. so that pretty much take way torpedo boat ability to fight .. DD is already penalized by limited no. of DD per side, new CV aerial threat, Hydro, and over extended availability of Radar and now this and even longer reach and longer duration Radar with this ... I do not think this is in anyway a BALANCE at all ... if WG is concern about too much damage done by aerial torpedo then they should limit this kind of damage to aerial torpedo.

Its unfair to keep buffing Radar, nerfing torp and having nothing in return to keep DD viable especially with torpedo boat and concealment game play .. breaking the game play will further erode the game with even less diversity. For a start if flooding are to be nerfed in this manner, shouldn't the made flooding 100% for all torpedo hit disregarding , it would be a bad idea really but this chage is such a bad idea to start with

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BTW, I play mostly DD and if all these come into play, thank you I will still play DD but no way I will go forth to scout, to spot, or to try to inflict some damage, might as well just stay with the cruiser and BB ( after all they got decent AA ) .. so if WG keep breaking viable game play then do not expect the player to execute such game play element

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Honestly, new players' problem isn't the flooding mechanics. It is the lack of experience. Trial by fire is the best way to get the best out of the player. 

Then there is the biggest problem for new players, the obvious elephant in the room that most fail to see...

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I don't think the flooding change will adversely hurt torpedoboats at all.

I mean, how often do you see DDs rack up more than even 2k flooding damage? Players have already learned to conserve their damecon if they suspect DDs in the area, only using it when they get struck by torps, and using when they get flooded. 

I have almost 200 Shimakaze games, and I can confidently tell you that I never, for even one game, ever relied on floods to deal damage to enemy ships. I rely on my torpedo alpha to do that job. If I get floods that stick, that's already a bonus for me. 

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4 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

Honestly, new players' problem isn't the flooding mechanics. It is the lack of experience. Trial by fire is the best way to get the best out of the player. 

Then there is the biggest problem for new players, the obvious elephant in the room that most fail to see...

It is not about new players either. It is about those players who have played thousands of random battles and still immediately use dcp for a single fire....:Smile_facepalm:

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2 hours ago, Ryuuoh_DeltaPlus said:

I don't think the flooding change will adversely hurt torpedoboats at all.

I mean, how often do you see DDs rack up more than even 2k flooding damage? Players have already learned to conserve their damecon if they suspect DDs in the area, only using it when they get struck by torps, and using when they get flooded. 

I have almost 200 Shimakaze games, and I can confidently tell you that I never, for even one game, ever relied on floods to deal damage to enemy ships. I rely on my torpedo alpha to do that job. If I get floods that stick, that's already a bonus for me. 

 

I humbly disagree , I play DD and flooding is very much part of the equation just as fire is part of the equation for guns ( HE spamming ) .. there are many play style one can employ , using fire to had enemy BB got repair party activated in a calculated firing pending torp salvo is typical and  vice versa. When playing solo out the flooding mechanism might be of little use as enemy can safely heal / repair when they know that your torp on reload, but flooding when used in conjunction with other team members around is a very useful tactics. They can be an initiating hit and flood to get the enemy to repair or the additional ongoing damage to already on repair cool down enemies 

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When aircraft can look at FLAK smoke to avoid being hit. Would there be landing point/lines of shells, bombs and torpedo once they released?

When would proximity fuse being introduced?

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2 hours ago, _TAMAL_ said:

It is not about new players either. It is about those players who have played thousands of random battles and still immediately use dcp for a single fire....:Smile_facepalm:

wg (in small letters) is just using the new player excuse as a way of getting people on their side. If this goes through, then torpedo reload times should be halved. 

Players that do not learn, well, they should just flood out.

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