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CV rework FAQ

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There are a bunch of things that I still cannot agree with. I understand the simplification, but this is way too simplified.

1. Automated RP usage = troll fire/flooding to make CV sniping continuing to be big a problem. This should be toggleable.

2. No direct control of the ship when the planes are being controlled. If you want to control the ships the squadron will return to the ship. Why? Is there a problem with just forgetting the planes (in place) and switching back to the ship to avoid being hit? The planes will only circle around the area, being useless. Is that too hard to implement?

 

Something I came up on the top of my head:

Why WG don't do it like this: all things from the 'old' CV style stay, but you can only use strike planes like the 'new' style: switch to a single strike squadron and control that squadron to drop the payload, when that's done, switch to another squadron to deliver more payload. Only the squadron being controlled can strike, the rest can act as scouts. Fighters stay the same, except no Alt-attack/strafing. Of course the number of squadrons would be lesser than now.

Edited by Paladinum
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Is there a transcript somewhere? I would rather read that than to waste an hour of my life listening to WG's nonsense.

5 hours ago, Paladinum said:

There are a bunch of things that I still cannot agree with. I understand the simplification, but this is way too simplified.

1. Automated RP usage = troll fire/flooding to make CV sniping continuing to be big a problem. This should be toggleable.

2. No direct control of the ship when the planes are being controlled. If you want to control the ships the squadron will return to the ship. Why? Is there a problem with just forgetting the planes (in place) and switching back to the ship to avoid being hit? The planes will only circle around the area, being useless. Is that too hard to implement? 

Sorry WG, but automated consumable usage is just stupid. And this can be easily be solved by just adding in direct hull control. God knows why WG refuses to add it.  I have a theory that the game engine simply cannot handle such a feature but WG doesn't want to admit it for some reason.

5 hours ago, Paladinum said:

Something I came up on the top of my head:

Why WG don't do it like this: all things from the 'old' CV style stay, but you can only use strike planes like the 'new' style: switch to a single strike squadron and control that squadron to drop the payload, when that's done, switch to another squadron to deliver more payload. Only the squadron being controlled can strike, the rest can act as scouts. Fighters stay the same, except no Alt-attack/strafing. Of course the number of squadrons would be lesser than now.

Yeah I have seen others suggesting a similar idea. This rework gameplay is what manual drops should be. You direct planes via the RTS interface like normal, but when you hit alt it changes to the third person mode to aim the payload.

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WG: Screw the RTS Design, lets make it more of a rail shooter experience

 

 

I mostly play well on the reworked carriers than the old crappy RTS of what should be erased from now.

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Anyone knows how the AA works right now? Such a large squadron of planes flying towards me, I'd be sunk if solely leave AA to RNG god..

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3 minutes ago, Darkworld_2015 said:

Anyone knows how the AA works right now? Such a large squadron of planes flying towards me, I'd be sunk if solely leave AA to RNG god..

It is still a bit RNG unfortunately.

How it works is there are 2 types of AA. The first type does flat damage against planes. No RNG involved. If the gun does 300 damage per second, then planes take 300 damage each second they remain in the aura. This type is mostly limited to short and medium range AA.

The 2nd type is flak. These are the puffs of smoke you see in the rework videos that planes have to avoid otherwise they will take massive damage. Flak is used by your long range AA. Unfortunately flak AA is very RNG. Sometimes there will be a path you can fly through to avoid taking damage, other times RNG will screw you and throw up a wall of flak which you can't avoid.

Another change is you can't click on planes as a surface ship anymore. Instead what you do is reinforce AA sectors to buff the AA on one side of your ship while weakening the other. So if planes are coming from the left, then you buff the left AA sector. If the planes fly over to the right, you switch the buff over to the other side. If you are unsure where the planes are going to be, then you can just equalise the AA sectors, so no side is buffed or weakened.

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5 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

Instead what you do is reinforce AA sectors to buff the AA on one side of your ship while weakening the other

So if two Squadron coming from 2 CVs, one on the left, one on the right, i can balance 50% 50% right? 

 

Consider Sushi has terrible AA, 60 dps per sec, that means i m doomed if a Essex or Taiho focus om me.... 

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Just now, waichung1823 said:

So if two Squadron coming from 2 CVs, one on the left, one on the right, i can balance 50% 50% right? 

 

Consider Sushi has terrible AA, 60 dps per sec, that means i m doomed if a Essex or Taiho focus om me.... 

Yes you can balance the AA sectors.

For the low AA ships like Sushi, the Catapult Fighter is your best defence actually. But it is much better to find some high AA ship and hug them like they are your waifu.

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2 minutes ago, Thyaliad said:

Yes you can balance the AA sectors.

For the low AA ships like Sushi, the Catapult Fighter is your best defence actually. But it is much better to find some high AA ship and hug them like they are your waifu.

Haha then i must stick to them like my waifu, or maybe div with ma mate 

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My latest thoughts on the new CV. The beta testing was too buggy to really get a good impression. After playing on the PT I think the mechanics are pretty good. I have 2 problems. 

1. The rocket aim is bad. To me they don't seem to go to where the center of the crosshair is aimed.

2. The tier gap makes the lower tier CV too underpowered. At low tiers it's like death from a thousand cuts. If you are left facing 3 or even 2 BB they can cross the map and kill you before you can sink them. At T10 you can often down a BB in 2 strikes. At T6 they can easily survive 4 strikes.

 

For those asking about AA. It's been dumbed down, Nothing manual, more RNG. If there is some AA sector thingy then it's damn obscure.

edit: Had a good hunt. AA sector reinforcment is activated by pressing O which brings up a display on HUD to choose sector.

Edited by keskparane

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10 hours ago, Thyaliad said:

Yes you can balance the AA sectors.

For the low AA ships like Sushi, the Catapult Fighter is your best defence actually. But it is much better to find some high AA ship and hug them like they are your waifu.

Problem is I heard we can't extend our AA range with mod/skill, mean really have to hug very hard (close). Another issue is those with low DPS short range ships (e.g. KM), they gonna suffer... 😞

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10 hours ago, Thyaliad said:

It is still a bit RNG unfortunately.

How it works is there are 2 types of AA. The first type does flat damage against planes. No RNG involved. If the gun does 300 damage per second, then planes take 300 damage each second they remain in the aura. This type is mostly limited to short and medium range AA.

The 2nd type is flak. These are the puffs of smoke you see in the rework videos that planes have to avoid otherwise they will take massive damage. Flak is used by your long range AA. Unfortunately flak AA is very RNG. Sometimes there will be a path you can fly through to avoid taking damage, other times RNG will screw you and throw up a wall of flak which you can't avoid.

Another change is you can't click on planes as a surface ship anymore. Instead what you do is reinforce AA sectors to buff the AA on one side of your ship while weakening the other. So if planes are coming from the left, then you buff the left AA sector. If the planes fly over to the right, you switch the buff over to the other side. If you are unsure where the planes are going to be, then you can just equalise the AA sectors, so no side is buffed or weakened.

What if you have DBs coming from bow on?

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19 minutes ago, Grygus_Triss said:

What if you have DBs coming from bow on?

2095800923_kissassbyebye.png.b31a48f23c883923f59148532308f546.png

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I fear the rework CV will simply aggravate the situation of spotting and scouting to the extreme; as of this moment DD and CL game-play had already been ruined by limitation of 4 DD per game ( is this actually being in implementation ) and abundance of Radar ; so many time I've seen game with more Radar per side over the number of DD , then we will flood the game with CV, ending with all just staying way out and shoot long range .. and now even the cruisers who do want to be out front to support the light force will need to stay back to survive. So we all end up with just a prolonged long range gun duel with all this ... Domination Game mode just turn to whoever able to long range kill more and kill quicker first; its no longer about the ability to actually go and cap , to dominate those areas.

I read many BB and CA player complaining about DD taking continuous HE spam on them but do they realize in the state of affair as per say, this is the only way they can remain alive and yet still contribute, any daring to go up front will got killed with certainty, and a dead ship do not contribute. The 20K Shima and Asasio torp suddenly become more relevant when all the others not. more and more DD players are seen to delay any move to go forth and stay well within  a battle line formed with BB and CA / CL cause that's the only way the can be sure to have support when needed , its not helped by so many guns player who only think of what the DD can do ( go cap, go spot, go scout ) but fail to realize the light force need IMMEDIATE fire support when they need it and of course this do not help when the guns are all far back and now the CV contribute to this. On one hand it made DD even less secure to go up front , and on the other DD are even less likely to willing to risk going up front to spot and scout ( hey ask the CV to send plane )

Right now the game balance is a joke as only the heavy armored BB and CA stand a chance to really deliver others had to scrap to survive, this is not a healthy situation. if WG want the Cl to be spear heading with CA and BB and DD to be vanguard for advance the need to made them possible to do that; all the changes in the last year and so slowly diminish that capability and  forcing the game play to turn more and more into a line of sight dimension only gun duel

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@Mechfori

What concerning is that DD players also complain about being permaspotted by CVs. Only one/two squadrons in the air at any time will lighten the situation, but that also keeps enemy DDs invisible for longer without being kept in check. It is even harder in situations where that one DD is the only thing that keeps the other team from winning. Or simply trying to cap, but the allied DD can't find the other DD (or it's dangerous to go deeper). 

The old CV gameplay can have too many squadrons in the air. The new one has way too few. And that's where the mentality of the general public comes in: trying to cause as much damage as possible, and ignoring any sense of teamwork. The CV rework will indeed worsen it. This is already bad right now. If a DD can't to spot/cap, other players (esp. BB players) will complain about him and report him, even there are valid reasons like radar ships around. It's not like I must oblige those people.

When you mention Shimakaze I remember that most Shima I see avoid caps and steer away from the cap points. It's a mystery for me.

 

PS. WG aren't the best at knowing when to stop. Sometimes they give too much, sometimes too little.
Currently, IJN CVs have too many squadrons, while US CVs have too many planes per squadron.
Right now, T4-6 CVs in the CV rework are really underwhelming to play, while the T10 can be devastating. 
They give tech tree RN ships too many gimmicks. They gimmicked the consumables and the shells when they could have gimmick only the consumables and the ships will still be good. 
Recently Yueyang was nerfed. There was no reason to nerf the RoF on that ship, and the torpedo reload was over-nerfed.

There are more examples but those are what I could recall.

Edited by Paladinum

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its not just the Shima, more and more DD are now reluctant, even refuse to go cap because in plain simple term .... no immediate and up front fire support, all the guns just choose to stay at Line C aka way out from the Areas .. enemy Radar, enemy DD, and now aerial spotting pretty much guarantee one cannot stealth cap and either one need to contest the cap or retreat .. and of course expect enemy guns to concentrate fire on you once they spotted the DD in the Area and well sorry your own team's guns are all too far to help. And of course if they do not go up front they do not spot either.

This is what it is right now .. frequently the team that will win the cap is the team that had the cruisers ( and some time BB too ) that will team up with their DD and go in , but risk their up front force being cross fired upon.

A lot of that had to go with any players tolerance of being fired upon and get damaged. Staying back is conservative but usually safe approach and I am seeing more and more guns that simply will run as quick as possible from incoming fire no matte what .. contributing to the light force even less likely to venture out. The rework CV will play into this I do think as their aerial spotting will made perma back lane sitter no longer a viable option. How will it affect I am not so sure

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My concerns are that giving unlimited planes to all CV is really dumbing down the gameplay. You are not really going to care too much when you lose some planes because "hey it doesn't matter I have an unlimited supply". Seems broadly a stupid idea. I can understand it for maybe at T4 for those learning CV but at T10 it is just stupid.

Also that AA build ships now are basically are very selfish builds as there is no longer the ability to assist the team with AA firepower and range. In current version you could defend an area and your AA aura would provide AA for friendly ships within that aura. In new version there are no range upgrades for ships, so you cannot help defend a team mate unless you are sailing right next to them. -1 to team work.

Has planes being able to spot ships through islands been fixed in the rework? AA shooting through islands? Also torpedoes magically coming out of islands and hitting your ship hopefully has been fixed. WG clearly has no concept of aircraft abilities even when applied to arcade style gameplay.

 

New vid from Notser showing current AA rework. Not very promising 😞

 

 

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14 hours ago, Mechfori said:

I fear the rework CV will simply ... - snip -  ...dimension only gun duel

A fine commentary. Summarized as: WG, -insertyourchoiceofexplicatives- fix Matchmaker. Fix the XP reward system. Stop -bleeping- with unnecessary ships first. Get your priorities in order.

Edited by dejiko_nyo

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12 hours ago, HobartAWD said:

My concerns are that giving unlimited planes to all CV is really dumbing down the gameplay. You are not really going to care too much when you lose some planes because "hey it doesn't matter I have an unlimited supply". Seems broadly a stupid idea. I can understand it for maybe at T4 for those learning CV but at T10 it is just stupid.

Also that AA build ships now are basically are very selfish builds as there is no longer the ability to assist the team with AA firepower and range. In current version you could defend an area and your AA aura would provide AA for friendly ships within that aura. In new version there are no range upgrades for ships, so you cannot help defend a team mate unless you are sailing right next to them. -1 to team work.

Has planes being able to spot ships through islands been fixed in the rework? AA shooting through islands? Also torpedoes magically coming out of islands and hitting your ship hopefully has been fixed. WG clearly has no concept of aircraft abilities even when applied to arcade style gameplay.

 

New vid from Notser showing current AA rework. Not very promising 😞

 

 

It’s been what I, as someone who doesn’t care too much about CVs, have been worried about since this started. And as Notser said, it’s felt like AA was the least important aspect of the rework.

But, they can’t really test this stuff in the test environment, it has to be live. Balance changes will be coming hot and fast when this goes live, but I think the core mechanics will stay the same.

While plane are teshnically unlimited, it takes a while for new planes to be ‘built’ after old ones are shot down. I like this idea, like unlimited torps and shells on ships. It can also be adjusted easily by making the plane building time longer or shorter. If cv players start spamming planes and cause too much damage, the plane build time can be lengthened. This also means AA can be increased without fear of completely deplaning CVs.

The lack of friendly AA is disturbing, but If you are a BB with some cruisers in front, planes would still need to navigate through the cruiser flack before they get to you.

I do worry about AA mounts over time, if you fight off several attack squadrons early in the game, the CV then retreats and rebuilds its planes, then is full strength for late game, by which time your AA mounts are been damaged... This could be a problem... Or it could be part of a new meta that CVs need to be hunted down and killed before AA has been too damaged.

Sigh. Still a lot to do, and it will all happen after it’s live. I hope we survive, I hope WG can balance correctly with creating a new CV dominated game...

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Oh no I just watch the AA gameplay

 

So we have endless plane supply with the reworked CV , but also we have now practically no AA at all or at best inferior and in effective AA for DD and BB ; now I am worried that any ships with AA build would have their build ruined and of course captain with skill invested

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I tried in PT server with FDG; basically it's my secondary build for KM BBs with BFT, AFT.

In live server, (more of GK instead of FDG) I can shoot down a few planes, even from Harkuyu or Midway, during their attack run or when they have dropped their payload ( GK captain standing in flame-covered conning tower pointing one popular finger at the retreating planes), but in PT server, my FDG could hardly shoot down planes from tier 8 carriers. Mind that my AA was almost full as nobody wanna shoot at me, at the plane was hovering between my long and medium range AA bubble (which is the stronger part of AA for FDG)

I went to port and drag out an Iowa specced for AA instead, and I ended up in a match wwith no CV! 

 

Edit: watched both videos from Notser, kinda got worried. Shorter AA range means no cover from teammates even sailing relatively, tactically close together, BBs and DDs can't do anything with incoming squadron... 

Edited by Darkworld_2015

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That was the other point I forgot to mention.

In current gameplay I can trade with a CV with any AA spec ship. Yes I may take damage and I may get some AA guns destroyed from bombs and from HE from other ships, but I will hurt the CV and whittle down his planes. CV has to make a tactical decision to continue to trade planes for damage or go elsewhere.

In rework version my AA guns can still get PERMANENTLY destroyed, but CV has unlimited planes and AA fire power now is extremely anaemic. Ship AA, even when AA spec is quite weak and it will get steadily weaker still as I lose AA mounts. I don't have a cooldown that I have to wait for and then magically all my AA gets fixed. My weak AA will get weaker as I take damage over the course of the game and there is nothing I can do to fix destroyed AA guns. CV on the other hand just has to sit through a cooldown and magically his planes that got destroyed are ready to go again. Balans™

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5 hours ago, Mechfori said:

Oh no I just watch the AA gameplay

WG once again have completely screwed up something that could have been tweaked and properly balanced, instead of completely reworked and ruined. 

How can a ship with AA spec build and Def AA consumable, use all of the Def AA and shoot down ZERO planes in a game? :Smile_amazed:

Edited by HobartAWD

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@HobartAWD 

Before CV rework: AA so RNG, 1000 dps shoots down 1 plane in a squadron while 10 dps shoots down an entire squadron.

After CV rework: AA so bad, couldn't shoot down any plane.

 

WG's handling of CVs is pure meme materials :Smile_teethhappy:

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