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mr_glitchy_R

Do not pick concealment expert on any low to mid tier BB.

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I just mount CE for my Lyon and it is truly pointless. I regret it. This skill is not suitable for any ship that has garbage concealment. Even some websites out there like the official WG portal and WoWS wiki didn't recommend me to pick one. But one of you ever told me in the Fuso complains thread to pick it as soon as possible when I got 4 points. But I'm trying not to do that for a moment because I'm still confused. let's face it. It only decrease the detection radius for a few kilometers. It would be great if WG doesn't bother with percentage and tell me how much CE does on a ship by kilometer. Also the detection range increases when a ship is on fire. And French BB is very vulnerable to fire. and that kinda force me to reach SE which is quite expensive. This skill only suitable when you have concealment upgrade combined. I have tried this on Chapayev and it worked really well.

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That lower concealment allows u to disengage more easier (every distance can save u)

No,SE on a BB is much of a waste too, go for Basic of Survivability if you want fire to go off faster

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Super Tester
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Quite Wrong advice.

Infact, most low mid tier BBs cannot use most other t4 perks, that means CE is the best Choice.

NewMex with CE is 11.9km iirc.

If you cannot make it work, that's your problem and you need to improve. The choice is Solid.

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well~~~~ CE is now a UNIVERSAL taken skill, every class take it

(Which is bad, no skill should be universaly taken, because it mean WG made a super wrong move in skill design)

 

but in mid tier, it not my top priority,

personally I pick fire prevention first 

mid tier CA don't have scary firing range like high tier, as long as BB not over extend itself it shouldn't be too much trouble.

I got FP on my every kongo (normal kongo + ARP series)

but I'm sure as hell that I'll pick CE next when I have enough point.

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23 minutes ago, PGM991 said:

but in mid tier, it not my top priority,

personally I pick fire prevention first 

mid tier CA don't have scary firing range like high tier, as long as BB not over extend itself it shouldn't be too much trouble.

I got FP on my every kongo (normal kongo + ARP series)

but I'm sure as hell that I'll pick CE next when I have enough point.

CE is not for defensive purposes in mid tier, it helps you to get to proper position undetected. Every cruiser player shits their pants a little when a wild New Mexico appears out of no where at 12 km from their ships. 

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Consealment expert will allow you to ambush while in offensive and disengage while in defensive. The problem is most prople keep taking every shots as soon as the gun available.

 

Good BB player will hold their shots with extreme control and discipline to maximize impacts.

Edited by sunlo2013

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Super Tester
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Since we were talking about Lyon, I just played 10 games with a typical 10 points captain, PT, EM, SI, CE.

Granted, had a few bad games, but CE seems to be working well.

Screenshot_20180916-042755.thumb.png.468328826e7d9eee179a1e385de403d7.png

Incredibly easy to surprise cruisers even with 13km+ detection.

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11 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

I just mount CE for my Lyon and it is truly pointless. I regret it.

This could be very  valid with this particular ship. But like most skills, they are valid for particular ships and types also whether you are playing PVE (Op's) or PVP.

11 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

And French BB is very vulnerable to fire.

RN BB's also seem to be most susceptible to fire, particularly with the HE spam that is in the game. Bot's in op's is the worst.

In Operation Aegis, I switched my Queen Elisabeth/Warspite 19 point Skipper from CE to FP (Fire Prevention) and this resulted in a excellent change in their ability to stay in the fight and be much more tanky. Considering that I don't mind brawling with these ships, they are more fun to play. I am using this skipper in the Duke of York for Ultimate Frontier. Positioned at or near one of the entrances to the lagoon, its a case of "Get past me if you can".

KM BB's seem better with CE (and a 19 point skipper). The Scharnhorst particularly seems to scare the pants off the "Bot" cruisers. Also because she is quite tanky, you can mix it with the BB's.

Naturally, premium Damage Control & Repair Party is very helpful as well in both cases.

Sorry I don't play PVP atm or have Lyon or Fuso. But hopefully the above, plus the excellent advice of the other forum members will help you. 

Cheer's

Alex

B_T23

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You don't need CE for PvE. Random/Ranked/Clan battles are completely different story.

If you think about efficient builds, you must have CE and FP. Although for fun builds, it can change.

For example, full AA build sacrifices FP, full secondary build sacrifices both CE and FP, etc.

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Sorry everyone sorry. What I mean is FP not SE. I forgot names of skills.

1 hour ago, Bengal_Tiger23 said:

RN BB's also seem to be most susceptible to fire

Welp, I just found that French BB is more than that. One HE shell from nippon bias cruiser can set me two fire instantly. Which makes CE is quite useless because again Fire can increase the detection range. 

 

7 hours ago, sunlo2013 said:

Consealment expert will allow you to ambush while in offensive and disengage while in defensive

How about DD who ambush me and makes me detected and over focused by the enemy? Remember that DD has lower detection range although if a BB mount a CE.

If I'm using cruiser. I can finally appreciate it. Because I have radar.

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11 hours ago, icy_phoenix said:

Infact, most low mid tier BBs cannot use most other t4 perks, that means CE is the best Choice.

How about investing the first 1 or 2 points and then collect the another 2 points?

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Whatever the reason is, I will always take CE, in any tier, any ship, with a quote in my mind "people will get lesser time to react if you can get as close as possible, concealment expert makes it harder for them to react, causing a 80% chance of devastating strike unless your shell gets cursed by RNG"

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11 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

How about investing the first 1 or 2 points and then collect the another 2 points?

But what is so important in 2 points row that you must take?

I'd recommend reaching a 4pt skill first, then come back to lower points.

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51 minutes ago, icy_phoenix said:

But what is so important in 2 points row that you must take?

I'd recommend reaching a 4pt skill first, then come back to lower points.

Yea, maybe I can take BoS or other mandatory low point skill. But that only if I reach 4pt in tier 6. Because in This tier CE is not compatible.

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Hmm, I guess a statement like “Do not, for any ship…” is never correct. Maybe rather say “I would never, for any ship…”.

There are a number of general issues to consider:

·         What is the ships tier, concealment range with and without CE, armour scheme, main guns specs, secondaries damage with/without AFT, AA?

·         What is the players preferred playstyle?

·         Some BB’s have so long detection range that even the 14% reduction means they are still always detected in open water.

·         Some people may prefer to go engage at closer distances, so even with CE they never drop back into concealment.

·         Some BB’s have weak secondaries, so the small buff from BFT/AFT may not be the best use for a 3 or 4 point skill.

·         In many battles, the secondaries will not fire a single shot, CE is always an advantage.

For some ships CE is an easy choice. Look at T8 Monarch which has only 14.6km basic detection range, down to like 10.9km as a full concealment build. Some cruisers are getting envious... For this more fragile BB this short detection allows to carry out a surprise attacks and control engagements, disappearing back into concealment becomes an option.

Now T7 Lyon with her 15.8km detection range and good secondaries, she would benefit from both AFT and CE. However, I would say her strengths are speed and many barrels, rather than big guns and tough armour.

Compare with T7 Gneisenau 15.6km detection. Also fast, only 6 = half Lyon’s barrels, but larger calibre main guns and tougher armour. Maybe slightly stronger secondaries, I didn’t look. On top 6km torps.

Without considering the players playstyle, I guess I would pick CE for Lyon (make it a sniper) and AFT for Gneisenau (make it a brawler).

I personally cannot claim that I am very good at using CE to my full advantage. However, I see the point that CE is an advantage in every battle, AFT is situational.

Personally I never tried FP, not sure if that’s worth it. And RDF on a BB? Not sure...

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But...but...but, My ARP Kongo using SE.

And its works like a charm (Blast brain-dead cruiser got cough showing broadside to me)

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Fuso for example goes from insta-spotted to spotted when she can insta-delete CAs...

Yeah nah, you need to learn how to abuse concealment

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Problem is, almost all other BB has CE so if you dont, you will always be the first to lit up and will permanently lit up so get focused fire too often then die quickly without any meaningful contribution

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37 minutes ago, zergling_ said:

Problem is, almost all other BB has CE so if you dont, you will always be the first to lit up and will permanently lit up so get focused fire too often then die quickly without any meaningful contribution

Problem is, CE need support with HA, BoS, or FP. Because when you are being set on fire, your detection range became larger. It also important to pick other mandatory skills or upgrades that has relation to it. Actually getting over focused, have some meaningful contribution. You just need to be stick with your allies. This way they can fire at the enemy without getting annoyed. But that doesn't mean when you are over focused, you can't fire your guns and wreck your opponents.

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On 9/16/2018 at 5:05 AM, PGM991 said:

well~~~~ CE is now a UNIVERSAL taken skill, every class take it

(Which is bad, no skill should be universaly taken, because it mean WG made a super wrong move in skill design)

As such, any non-CE build can be framed in as a +10-16% concealment nerf. It divides the ships into have/have-not and significantly penalizes ships that require you to take another 4 pt skill first, like IFHE. Inasmuch as it incentives players to run 10/14 point captains on all their ships it cannot be said to be a bad move on the part of WG, but for good or for ill making the skill selection as CE>>>>>>>>[everything else] means that all the super-neat builds are effectively restricted to 15-19 point captains.

general comment:

CE is always useful, it is the most universally useful 4 point skill on BBs. You will take less damage with CE. You will do more damage with CE. With IJN BB line it is probably the least useful however. You're gonna spend most of the game detected either way. Even there I'd still probably take it as the first 4 point skill though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Rina_Pon

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8 hours ago, mr_glitchy_R said:

Problem is, CE need support with HA, BoS, or FP. Because when you are being set on fire, your detection range became larger. It also important to pick other mandatory skills or upgrades that has relation to it. Actually getting over focused, have some meaningful contribution. You just need to be stick with your allies. This way they can fire at the enemy without getting annoyed. But that doesn't mean when you are over focused, you can't fire your guns and wreck your opponents.

At this point i'd only say, just trust us on this. CE is much better than not having CE over not having those FP, BoS or HA. It looks like you are just reading up the skills and have no experience about actually using any of those. As you gain more experience, you will start to realize what we all are talking about here.

The skills you need for a survival focused BB is as follows: PT, EM, SI, CE, FP, BoS, (HA/JoAT/AR).

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