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GRADAN31

Des Moines with spotter plane

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Credits: Yuro

Are we getting more DM with spotter plane? Or people will just protest with negative karma button?

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Beta Tester
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A true Seaman Warrior picks the consumable that brings more guns to the fight: the Catapult Fighter Plane. Anything else is just for frivolous sightseeing.

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That's right DM players

Listen to /ourguy/ Yuro and bring spotter Des Moines to randoms 

 

HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEEEHHEH

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As someone who grinded Old New Orleans ( is it just ‘Orleans’ now?) by camping behind islands and radaring caps, I can see why NOT playing DM as a radar ship is a good thing. As Yuro says, if you don’t rush to hide behind islands bear caps, you can do much more DPS, Thus contributing more by sinking ships. Having radar equip means you may be forced into the mentality of radar ship play style.

The spotter plane assists in the DPS focused gameplay, more so than radar. Of course, there’s nothing saying that you can’t focus on DPS and use radar for mid-late game when you need to hunt down those DDs.

Problem is that some players are so scared of DDs that they see it as the DUTY DMs and other radar ships to get in there and flush the buggers out, while focusing their guns on something more juicy.

Ultimately, if you have the skills to back you up, use whatever consumable combinations suit you. If you play well using the ‘wrong’ consumables, you should not be blamed because you’re not using a ship as effectively as you should be. Especially if you did better than your critics.

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Look. I'm gonna just say it. 

If a player is not mindful enough to not get stuck in the "ME RADAR SHIP, ME HAVE TO RADAR DDs" mindset, changing consumables is not gonna cut it because they're likely not going to be good enough to dodge the shells coming their way, or be able to consistently hit ships at extreme ranges anyways (contrary to NA, where Yuro now plays, our BBs can actually dodge enough cruiser shells if they're on the move) 

There's no reason not to play DM as a DPM ship while bringing RADAR to the table. 

@_buki and @Adm_Kunkka are extremely good players, and are very formidable in their Des Moines. I have yet to see either of them picking spotter plane over RADAR as a serious or competitive option.

 

Edited by OtomeprincessTH

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I find spotter planes of questionable value according to my utility assessment. The only definitive benefit it provides is extended battery range and better targeting sight. However, whether your shells connect is another story.

People can chose whatever they want as long as it complements their playstyle. Like why I prefer smokeataur to radarataur because I can contribute more being a smokey nuisance.

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there's no such thing as 'wrong' play style.

even my shimakaze either 20 km 12 km or 8 km torpedo, all are correct play style.

it's up to player which he most comfortable with.

Yuro are among 0.1% player that are insanely good skill.

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12 hours ago, PGM991 said:

there's no such thing as 'wrong' play style.

even my shimakaze either 20 km 12 km or 8 km torpedo, all are correct play style.

it's up to player which he most comfortable with.

Yuro are among 0.1% player that are insanely good skill.

True, he is good.

 

13 hours ago, dejiko_nyo said:

I find spotter planes of questionable value according to my utility assessment. The only definitive benefit it provides is extended battery range and better targeting sight. However, whether your shells connect is another story.

People can chose whatever they want as long as it complements their playstyle. Like why I prefer smokeataur to radarataur because I can contribute more being a smokey nuisance.

When Minotaur first came out, people complaints about Minotaur not using smoke, then slowly people accepts it. I wonders how long will it take for people to accept spotter DM. If I remembered correctly, Yuro also mentioned in another video that spotter play has a further circling range, so it can spot torpedoes earlier. Of course, fighter is better on CA because of the 6mins air time.

 

I play DM as a close range gun boat with main battery mod 3 to boost my DPM. This is to compensate for my lousy aiming with more shells per min. Also, lower range to prevent spotting by enemy from far after firing, since I cannot aim well from far. but current 15.8km is a bane at times when i need to hunt enemy from far. Maybe my play style (don't need to hit far) is more suited for USN CL line than CA line. Will try out more in test server before getting my karma dropped.

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10 hours ago, GRADAN31 said:

When Minotaur first came out, people complaints about Minotaur not using smoke, then slowly people accepts it. I wonders how long will it take for people to accept spotter DM.

It didn't take long for people to start realizing the potential of radar minotaur. I myself exclusively use radar on my minotaur as well. However DM is one of the oldest ships, and ever since radar was added to it, noone has found spotter plane optimal on it. It's objectively a weaker option than running radar. And just because yuro has good stats while running it doesn't prove its better. That's just the thing about good players-they can make sub-optimal builds work.
So unless you're one of the top 5% players, you shouldn't even attempt this because you will just embarrass yourself when you fail to deal significant damage while also being unable to provide the radar support normally expected of a DM?
And if you'd argue that spotter plane on DM enhances your damage output, let me remind you that there are many DM players with 140-150k avg damage while running radar

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I think the point Yuro was trying to make was less about the build but that camping an island near a cap where you have limited options for shooting at enemies will limit your DPM quite a bit or in some cases have none at all. Sure you can pop radar on a DD and have it knocked out, but what have you done in the meantime? I think there are certainly players camping islands contributing nothing but radar. I don't play cruisers at that level, so I can't say how it should be done, just I've seen people doing it wrong.

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Also, good luck hitting anything in DM at 20km range. Hard enough to hit reliably at much closer ranges than that. Not a build I would even consider tbh.

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1 hour ago, Sparcie said:

I think the point Yuro was trying to make was less about the build but that camping an island near a cap where you have limited options for shooting at enemies will limit your DPM quite a bit or in some cases have none at all. Sure you can pop radar on a DD and have it knocked out, but what have you done in the meantime? I think there are certainly players camping islands contributing nothing but radar. I don't play cruisers at that level, so I can't say how it should be done, just I've seen people doing it wrong.

Team play dictates that a DM sitting at island denying cap with radar while doing minimal actual dmg himself is fine. He contributes potentially much more by denying cap than if he gets 150k dmg.

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I read Yuro's advice not as "never take RADAR" but rather "take the spotter plane to train yourself to play as heavy cruiser". i.e. learn to walk by throwing away the crutches.

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4 hours ago, Sparcie said:

I think the point Yuro was trying to make was less about the build but that camping an island near a cap where you have limited options for shooting at enemies will limit your DPM quite a bit or in some cases have none at all. Sure you can pop radar on a DD and have it knocked out, but what have you done in the meantime? I think there are certainly players camping islands contributing nothing but radar. I don't play cruisers at that level, so I can't say how it should be done, just I've seen people doing it wrong.

No thats just false. Any good DM player will be able to provide both radar and damage output with correct positioning.
And as  a DM you're not expected to be firing your guns the whole game. It is usually better to go dark and look to reposition to a better spot than trying to spam HE at max range.

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Super Tester
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You guys are missing another point Yuro made in that video which is very legit. Many players play Des Moines with RADAR cause "they have to", but they either are very bad at picking up locations or do not ever get close to. Yuro's video was made for these players. Instead of picking RADAR and not becoming very useful in the battle, they can still contribute, since they are passive anyway. And I think he IS right.

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It's not skilled players I'm talking about, it's players that get trapped against the island they initially camp and then overwhelmed when the enemy flanks or pushes to the point they kill them. partly because they don't have an escape planned or don't try to escape when they should. Often they don't do much damage in the process. The idea that they must be there for radar is half the reason they fail, get trapped and die. Yuro demonstrated an alternative play style, you  don't have to like it, but it clearly worked well for him.

I thought the whole point of the Des Moines was she''s a DPM monster, but if you think it's ok I guess it's fine. I haven't played her so I don't know.

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Remind me to try a few games in the Des Moines the next time the test server goes up (I'm still in the Pensacola on the live server).

 

It's completely unrelated to the Des Moines questions here, but does taking a spotter plane instead of Surveillance Radar work for the Cleveland at T8? Given their similarly horrible ballistics at long range (be it the USN 152mm or 203mm), similar consumable choices, and similar number of guns, I'm curious as to whether or not it will work.

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4 hours ago, TD1 said:

It's completely unrelated to the Des Moines questions here, but does taking a spotter plane instead of Surveillance Radar work for the Cleveland at T8? Given their similarly horrible ballistics at long range (be it the USN 152mm or 203mm), similar consumable choices, and similar number of guns, I'm curious as to whether or not it will work.

Yes you can take Spotter Aircrafts. Cleveland's ballistics are much better now, compared to old T6. Also, the US heavy cruiser ballistics are not as bad as people make it out to be. In order to be able to use RADAR properly, you need very good knowledge of maps and high tier mind games. Using spotter is relatively easier.

Edited by icy_phoenix

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[KGHSF]
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But USN didn't make for high velo shell

and radar didn't scan for wide range either

9.5 km 

If DM get behind the rocks,launched spotter and make plunging fire er....... caused more annoyed like Zao did 

~YURO/YOLO  nice names

 

Edited by THAI_THIEF

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I will summarise from these conversations/posts. 
1. Spotter plane DM will remain rare, because only some will do well.

2. Spotter plane is just another alternative built, player should try out what they prefer/do well before sticking to the sigma that DM is a radar CA only.

3. Try out on test server to prevent karma loss and income loss.

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Uhuh... Yuro doing lol-stuff as usual...

He's pretty good which is why he can pull off silly stuff like this... You know or he records a stack of matches to get the 1 good one (this is what he actually does).

Yuro being Yuro

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[LBAS]
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As someone who loves their DM but isn't very good in it.....

I look forward to other DM's on the other side doing this. It gives me more air-craft to shoot down and thats a nice XP bonus.

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