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Hanger556

DoY Campaign - Glad it's over, room for improvement

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As the dull glow of 2017 slowly fades along with the agony and the esctasy that was the DoY/NYE campaigns, I felt it was time to put some thoughts to virtual paper. Turns out, many others have already voiced their feelings; mine isn't dissimilar.

Others have written about their analysis and experience of the campaign in greater detail, but the gist of it (mine included) goes something like this:

 

  • The Campaign was really really hard, almost unreasonably so, but not just because of the missions themselves but because of the artificial time limit placed on them. This lead to some weird and desperate behaviour, like UK ships on suicidal spotting or torpedo runs.

 

  • The alternative was to grind A LOT of xp. Normally a viable not-too-painful alternative, but the time limit made this task a chore and more often than not, because the XP target was so high, it was still faster to score torpedo hits or ram BBs or whatever was necessary.

 

  •  The difficulty of some tasks depended on what ships (and what tier) were in your fleet. For an experienced DD captain, 90k torp damage in a tier X DD was apparantly not difficult. If you did not have a tier X DD captain, achieving this required a small miracle. To be fair, some people still managed to do this in a Gallant and I take my hat of to these captains, but this is the exception rather than the norm.

 

  •  For skilled captains with a large diverse fleet of ships and (more importantly) the free time to play, this campaign was difficult but doable, the tasks made shorter by their skill and the best ships for the task. For people who had to juggle families, a job and other video games, the time limit was added pressure they didn't need. For people without the right high tier ships, the missions bordered on impossible.  

 

  • The Duke of York is underwhelming. It's not the garbage ship some people make it out to be, in fact it's not even that bad a ship, but compared to its KGV sibling it's distinctly inferior. There's an argument that we shouldn't complain because it's a free ship, though I find that idea flawed for 3 reasons
    • 1) For the people that paid for it, this is clearly not true
    • 2) The notion that cost has some bearing on quality begins to feel like pay-to-win, something WG has (mostly) been wise to avoid
    • 3) Given the amount of work it took to get this boat, the blood, sweat and tears, I almost resent the idea that this was a free boat

 

  • It's been said that people are just salty and ungrateful, we should just "git gud" and stop whinging about getting a free boat and free stuff, if we didn't want it we didn't have to play for it.
    • My response is the idea of this game, or any game for that matter, is to have fun. Playing WOWS is fun. Working towards targets, even difficult ones, is fun. Achieving difficult tasks and being rewarded, especially with interesting ships, is fun.
    • Being told a task is too hard for you so just don't play, isn't fun. (and as I mentioned above, it wasn't the tasks as much as the short time to do it in)
    • Having to drop everything to urgently grind for a boat, was not fun.
    • Being forced to play in selfish, suicidal and disruptive ways to earn this boat, was not fun.

I also think it is quite telling that (for me at least, and the other accounts I've read) most of the people who completed the DoY/NYE campaign felt relief it was over more than anything else. Not a sense of achievement, not even a 'look at my new boat, envious? You should get one too'. Just relief and exhaustion. 

 

What I'd like to see and future suggestions:

  • For now, no more urgent missions with too-good-to-pass-up rewards: Most accounts suggest the people who undertook the DoY/NYE campaign found it a tedious chore and more than a few (myself included) feel burnt out. It feels nice to lower the tempo for a while.

A good example is the missions for the the badges and emblems: This is perfectly fine; nothing special required, just play WOWS normally and you'll get them. You have until February, so no hurry.

Ten citadel hits a day is hard, but you know what? The rewards aren't that exciting, so I don't feel so bad for missing out. The 4 wins a day mission has a nice camo, and the requirement is low, so I'm happy to jump through that low hoop for now.

 

  • I don't know what the exact solution is, but it's often been said how great it would be to have mission objectives that encouraged team play. I understand the difficulty in making this a reality and this is really a different discussion topic, but it's worth remarking how much single-minded batshit crazy disruptive play was caused by almost everyone doing this campaign, myself included. My Gallant might as well been named the HMS Leeroy

 

  • For future tasks that require grinding credits and XP, perhaps including co-op and operations into the allowable missions would be a merciful step. Grinding is grinding, there's no need to make it painful grinding.

 

  • RNG tasks in a time limit mean finishing it a lottery. Knocking out modules and setting fires happens on a regular basis, so they're not to hard. Disabling the main gun? Devastating Strike? These are much harder to achieve. Asking for citadel strikes on a boat noted for its HE and weak AP means RNGeesus gets involved. Tasks you can progress towards are infinitely preferable to rare achievements. 

 

  • If it was Wargaming's intention that only a handful of elite players finish the campaign, raise the requirements up to tier IX-X so it's clearer that only a few people were meant to achieve this. 

 

  • The Santa boxes were fun (I spent far too much money on those 'macro' transactions). Buying ships is fun, and TBH if I could've paid for the KGV instead of the DoY I would have. Instead, once I realised the DoY was a 'meh' boat, I was really turned off spending dubloons or cash for her, especially when there was a campaign to get her for 'free', forcing me down the DoY campaign trail.

What I'm suggesting is more value for our consumer dollars, make me want to spend it because of something nice at the end. Making me pay so I can end the pain makes me inclined to stop playing overall.

Lol, just joking. I'm an addict. 

But seriously though, I'd pay the asking price for a Belfast or a Kutusov, noted 'gud botes' I'm desperately hoping will come on sale again. The DoY? Forget about it. Even if there was no campaign I wouldn't pay for it, I'd rather convert free XP for the KGV, or buy the Scharnhorst instead.

 

  •  Finally, the time limit was the biggest complaint this season. I'm not exactly sure what the staggered release of the campaign was meant to achieve (force them to buy the DoY?? See above), but it did mean that even if the working adults amongst us did have free time over the holidays, they couldn't use it to complete the campaign. The short time span really favoured players who could grind for hours endlessly in the post new-year period instead. 

This was the single biggest frustration that caused the feeling of not-having-fun. If I could have changed one thing about the campaign it would have been this. 

Overall, I'm glad to have gotten the DoY 'for free' and earned 5 other tier VI boats in the process as well. Without the time limit, I don't think the campaign was all that hard, just a bit tedious, and in the end I had more fun than not, but only barely. I think this campaign could've done with some balancing and tweaking and it would've been great.  

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Well said OP.

I too think part of it is due to the ridiculous time limits. The other campaigns like Yamamoto have some crazy requirements, but unlike the DoY campaign they are not time-limited.

I much preferred last year's Graf Spee missions. Sure they were a lot more grindy and perhaps boring, but it didn't require me to do crazy stuff. All I had to do was just play the game normally, and play well if I wanted to grind faster.

And there is the matter of the reward itself. The Graf Spee is a pretty unique ship. No other ship in the game was like it. The same can't be said for the DoY though. The DoY is mostly a nerfed KGV with Hydro and better AA.

Imo the DoY would have been a lot more interesting if it had stayed as its initial version where it did not have a heal but had cruiser fire duration and DFAA in addition to Hydro. 

All these together just leaves a horrible after-taste now that the campaign is over. All I can remember from this campaign is spamming my Gallant to complete the final tasks. Not a good memory at all.

Edited by Thyaliad

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I didn't even try.

Looked at what was involved and the time limit, and there was no way. Time over xmas was too valuable for me.

Do I care? yes a little. I'm not all broken up over it, but at this stage there is too much in the game that is not achievable for players with limited time and resources, too many missions that are ship dependant etc, even operations, after buying one of the premium ship packs I STILL find I cant play some of the operations.

I have said in other posts that new/low tier players get neglected as well as being disadvantaged by poor MM at low tiers, and I still think its something they need to work on.

But grats on getting the Duke. Well done. I hope you enjoy it.

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I think campaign was quicker to complete than reading that post;). 

OK, my 2c. Campaign was not about the DOY.it was about getting free port slots/ a couple of T6s I had not unlocked. And the 50% camos. The DOY is just another meh premium. 

And WG want to use these missions to make people spend $$$$. Be it buy the Gallant to do the 11 trip miss, premium time etc.

Overall the rewards in Total are still pretty decent. DOY isn't a complete disaster, she'll be useful as a captain. Retrainer.

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I seriously hate this year's campaign. Especially when compared with Spee campaign 2016-2017.

 

>DoY campaign.

1. The mission demands too much grinding. As we all know, part 4 and 5 are way too hard. Spee campaign's EXP mission only required 25K while DoY campaign asked for a freaking 75K.

2. Too much ship type and/or nationality specific tasks. Arguably, inter-class balance during non-event time is *fairly* good, no class gets spammed. And DoY campaign scrambled all this fragile balance devs and players fought for almost three years to accomplish. We see huge amount of cruisers during early stage, BBs trying to get Dreadnought and HC in part 4, tons of DD in part 5. (and BB spam again trying to get the same achievement for New Year campaign) The balance branch would probably want to kick the marketing staff at the balls for ruining their hard work.

3. Non-teamworking requirements. Spee campaign is usually about credits and EXP, no of which requires the player to play out of ordinary. And this year we get things like cruiser spam a BB, RN ships spot Germans, torp 90K in one game, and other requirements that demands players to ditch their teamwork responsibility.

 

>DoY reward.

Honestly I kinda liked the ship. It allows me to play T7 scenario with my friends and grind RN captain without resorting to Hood. But I see absolutely NO WORK TIME and NO SINCERITY in this ship. Again compare with Spee.

1. Spee is a new model while DoY is not. The origin of this DoY model (which I clearly know is not the KGV one) is during RN BB supertesting. There was a few phases when KGV had no aviation equipment, but in the end KGV was released with a catapult, the model without one got archived, and with minor changes gets released as DoY.

2. Spee has new guns while DoY does not. Making the ballistics of a gun is a sophiscated and delicate task. WG promised to carefully match the historical performance. A gun's data has five parts that affects ballistic performance, muzzle velocity, shell weight, caliber, drag coeff and Krupp value. While caliber, MV and projectile mass can be simply copied from sites like NavWeaps, fine tuning air drag and Krupp is a hard task, the devs have to adjust the value carefully to match the arcs and penetration. Each of these values have usually four digits, which IMO demonstrates how exhaustive such work is. FYI Spee guns are historically and in game different from Scharnhorst ones, while DoY simply copied the ballistic performance of KGV ones.

3. Spee has a unique play style while DoY is a try hard KGV wannabe. Spee demonstrates many qualities of a BB, large caliber, low RoF, repair party, emphasis on AP… which makes her truly unique for a cruiser. But statistically speaking, Spee performs on par with her T6 counterparts, a respectable feat in terms of balancing. DoY is simply an overnerfed KGV with hydro and AA buffed. Unconfirmed sources also indicated better ricochet angle and better accuracy than KGV, but these changes does not differentiate DoY enough from a KGV.

 

>New Year campaign.

I guess… not much to complain, it is supposed to be (and in fact is) a rather easy and relaxing grind. The one star tasks are still somewhat too specific, and it did cause the late event BB population boom. But the generic two star tasks are easy.

 

>New Year reward.

The camouflages this year does not match the amount of effort and aesthetics of Spee campaign ones. And the ice camo does not offer any additional benefits unlike Tirpitz one.

 

Additionally, remember "freemium is not free". DoY is not worth the money/time we spent on. And being a premium does not mean it should be subpar in terms of performance. The community has been going overboard with the P2W sux "political correct" view. Simply put, I am more okay with slightly-moderately OP premium ship than underperforming premiums. And being given a free prem doesn't mean we should not complain. Firstly it is a virtual property, which means unlimited duplication, giving it away does not mean any loss for WG. Also even if none of us paid for DoY, our game time also makes potential payers think the game is active and make them more willing to pay (less worries about "what if I paid for it and no one plays the game") 

Edited by HMS_Swiftsure_08

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3 hours ago, j0e90 said:

And WG want to use these missions to make people spend $$$$. Be it buy the Gallant to do the 11 trip miss, premium time etc.

Just another blatant cash grab by WG. As if they weren't making tons of money from Santa crates already, let's keep milking money from the playerbase by making the North Cape campaign extremely tedious! Glad I'm still a F2P player. WG is not getting any money from me if they continue like this. Of all the campaigns, North Cape is by far the worst and I will not miss it.

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Being able to do some of the tasks in coop can make a big difference in the enjoyment levels. That one requiring 150k dmg to dds would have been fine as a coop task, but I wouldn't even attempt it in random.

As you say, the deadline hanging over your head really put the damper on the fun.

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Well the DoY event gave me a bitter taste of WG's desperate or bad planning, the time gated event's pacing is absolutely horrible & the final 75k xp mission is the only decent way for players without compromising the whole team's chance of victory & that 10 batteships kills (steal) mission is a joke... WG is the one that is pushing/pressuring players to play badly & creating such an unhealthy gaming environment, shame on you! :cap_viking:

 

Judging from the previous year Graf Spee xmas event & other smaller events after it, I dare to say WG on the whole knew what they were doing & did it on purpose plus the 75k xp mission was on the very week that had no 100% xp bonus (coincidence or ?)... WG needs to stop milking so hard & scaring off F2P players or there would be nothing left to keep your whales/unicums entertained & they would have to face the same few faces everyday.

 

DoY itself is just a downgraded version of KGV, nothing interesting except it's a free RN captain trainer for newer players but with the introduction of elite captain xp... there is no longer any reason to bring it out besides those annoying missions that require fire damage & BBs only aka badly planned forced missions again.

 

The new year final mission reward which is Scharnhorst's Arctic camo had no extra 100% fxp bonus unlike Tirpitz's Tarnanstrich camo from last year's xmas event, I was more excited in the tech tree ships rewards as it lets me skip so many boring ships before it & save up my precious consumables... keep in mind T6 above are all rank viable so the perma camos that comes with the warships has way more value in the long run. Sure~ WG can add extra bonus stats for the Scharnhorst/DoY's Arctic camo later on like what they did previously for other camos but the damage is already done, players like me who skip the final reward because we saw no value in the camo to begin with.

 

And you guys think WG would learn & cut some slack then came the 2nd part of Haifuri collaboration event, that is a whole new can of worms but I'll stop at that because Reddit & NA forums are already ranting about it... what I will say though is that I will never ever spend doubloons on premium time to speed up any time gated grindy missions that gives only 1-2 stars for 37k+ xp requirement & that is already the daily 3 containers limit which is already painful:cap_fainting:

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i agree with OP the campaign is too time limiting, we all have lives to go through, and spending rest of the time grinding it isn't fun at all. This stands true when your team is not focusing on winning but instead torping / kill stealing BBs. I started

to have a mind that if  i finish it..great, if not...its not anymore than a game pixel.

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Hard to says if i should complain about this campaign, since i play mostly IJN ship, i have enough ship to fulfill all  mission and rush all of it in two week  even i'm not a good player  (still have 3 day left for new year raid and get Eliz)

Anyway this year campaign indeed too much grind and RNG, i hate the kind of mission like kill x number of ships and get an achievement and the reward not event worth it.......

Meanwhile for DoY, i don't hate it, but hard to say i like it either, while the gun is ok to me, the survivability is  totally meh,  WG should buff her torpedo protection a little more and give her 1 more heal.

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4 hours ago, HMS_Swiftsure_08 said:

FYI Spee guns are historically and in game different from Scharnhorst ones, while DoY simply copied the ballistic performance of KGV ones.

Personally I didn't even bother. I agree with all comments and these are pretty much the reasons I did not start such a stupid campaign. I did not want to put so much time and effort into receiving an inferior copy of a KGV.

However unlike the Spee and Scharnhorst which had many differences in their guns, DoY and KGV both have the same BL 14 inch Mk VII naval guns. I'm not surprised they copied the gun performance data of KGV seeing they have the same gun and fire the same shells.

Isn't the gun data from the Admiralty gun tests enough? Surely you don't expect WG to get the actual gun data from that actual ship? At any rate this would vary anyway depending on barrel wear.

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I stopped at Mission 5 because end of the day:

Still another KGV clone with premium benefits.

These task  aint worth the time to grind for a KGV where u can get easily through tech tree

 

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I haven't been playing much and still managed to get right up to mission 5...

I didn't think it was hard, just time consuming and I couldn't care enough to invest the time (yes still annoyed at WG after CB timezone fiasco).

Also wasn't interested in DoY, only the Scharnhorst Camo and the time investment or money for that, no thanks.

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Early December my PC break down.. I end up have to repair it and such..replacing almost everything like motherboard, processor and ram. Even now, I still need a new monitor and speaker. 10 days back I got my PC back install wows and look around. Ouch..ranked.. hmmm.. enjoy it for 4 days and stop.. and then I check the DoY campaign...

I am about sure to miss this one. Cant have the time, but then, I totally abandon ranked and focus for the campaign. I made it.. first part..took me 4 days and the second part took me 2 days.. yeah that 2 days come from the extension from WG due to whatever..whatever. Its hard, but doable..and took me 2 days of prem acc. Its, if u want u can do it. I am a bad player myself..no skill. I think those unicum player wont have any trouble at all.

Tho I totally agree with the comment.. Graf Spee campaign are much more fun and it doesnt require u to play in a bad way.

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I was in a similar boat as far as the PC dying. My PCs motherboard was shot having cooked itself running at 85C rook me 5 days to get the parts i needed CPU mobo and RAM. got it back on the 9th and took all day to download Wows, 30-40 GB download.  At that point I had about 10 days and it took 2-3 days for each of the tasks after the first one. wasn't expecting to finish and at 0.7.0 had just finished the 4th task. I also had to upgrade to win 10 as my hardawre wasnt supported by win 8.1 and messages reminding me of this would popup randomly that was done overnigh twhile i slepth.

Had  a look at the final set for the final tasks and selected tasks 2,3,4 as those looked most feasible. couldnt get 90 k damage with just torps as BBs were all too cagey and seemed to be able to predict where i was and when i was firing torps alot of the time even though i wasn't spotted. I smelt something fishy bout that  I had no trouble before those 2 days landing torp hits. There were constantly 4-6 radar ships a side as well as sonar.there were also contstantly 5+ BBs a side. Task 3 was theonly viable one as the others i only managed 10 BB kills and at best 85k damage in torp hots. on of my battles in the last 2 days I was in my kamikaze R and jumped 4 DDs and finished of an Emerald got a kreaken with only 40k damage all torps even got a double srtike.

Ended up grinding 135k xp per day in the the last 2 days took all my flags and camos that boosted the xp was getting 3-7k xp on a loss and anywhere from 5-15 k xp on a win took a total of 54 battles.

Ened up losing 10 karma points 5 of which was in the final battle before I got the DpY. i was with 2 of my clan mates and we were in Blyskawicia and it was the trap map my div went B the rest of them either hid behind the island north of  B or went A. One idiot insisted at least 1 DD Go A  By that time we were entering B. We had no aupport from anyone and it was too late to turn back then  retread typed report them..

The battle was lost by the time we entered B a as the BBs and CAs isolated themselves without DDs to screen and the DDs in B had no covering fire or air support The CV was useless and did noting to get the fighters that were spotting us  while we tried to retreat he sat there looking stupid. we managed to drive off and kill the DDs of the enemy that went B. All the BBs/CAs that went A survived but but accomplished nothing not even geting withing 12 km of the boundary of AD before they turned and ran.  I ended up reporting all of the srvivior ships on my team making sure  that the CV and the CA that typed report them got more than anyone else. You want to report people for playing badly in your eyes then I will report you also.

I feel disapointed in with the reward ship anf the fact that despite finishing the campain I still didnt finish the collection it feels like WG rigged the campaign and collection so that you would need to spend money to completed either the campaign. on completion of the Campaign i have 1 item left to collect and no way of getting it  used my last 4 duplicated to get the 15th. Couldnt even begin the second campaign as i had less than 12 hrs and I was exhausted.

As I had already spent $100 on Santa crates and only got 2 prems out of 20 containters + 6 k doubloons. the camos are worthless to me I have a large glut of them and the same with the flags. I wasnt going to spen another $on the ship or a container plus the DoY is by most  measures a worse ship than the KGV.

Started ranked over the weekend to relax, less stressful than the campaign.

This campaign still leaves i foul taste in my mouth i think i will have to find some dung to get the taste out.

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@Moganite sorry about your crates, WG loved me this year think I got 15.

Atlanta

Arizona

Perth

Dunkerque

Okhotnik

180 days

6k dubloons

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Thanks, it happens

I got Lo yang and the Gallant. The Lo yang is a good ship And the Gallant is a recent release that is also decent.:cap_happy:

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1 hour ago, Moganite said:

Thanks, it happens

I got Lo yang and the Gallant. The Lo yang is a good ship And the Gallant is a recent release that is also decent.:cap_happy:

Forgot I also got Lo Yang.

Gallant is good fun, I find the Lo Yang OP, at least in ranked...

I picked up Gallant for Dunkirk in August, haven't played it much since though.

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I think it was grindy because it gave you a free T7 Premo ship that'd normally cost 50 AUD

I certainly hope future campaigns are less grindy.

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On 23/01/2018 at 2:24 PM, Pocket_Fox said:

I think it was grindy because it gave you a free T7 Premo ship that'd normally cost 50 AUD

I certainly hope future campaigns are less grindy.

I hope for that too, but past history suggests it's an easy content for players.

Personally, it wasn't so much the grind as the time limit which really detracted from teh campaign. Grinds are a fact of gaming life, but usually you'll get there in the end. The deadline turned it into a sprint and the time-gate delay meant you could only run this race in the busy part of the new year, not during the holidays. 

I think WG wanted to force players to buy the DoY, and as I've said, I'd rather they entice me to buy something nice rather than force my hand.

In some ways it's similar to the removal of the Missouri; if you can't grind up the free xp the only other option is the use dubloons to convert ship XP.

But that's a different cause for salt discussion.

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These days, before I start a campaign, I "count the costs" so to say. When I think it's not worth it, I just ignore the mission.

A free ship, so what? It's not free anyway, considering that many buy camos or flags.

When you play 50 hours (or whatever is needed) to get a "free" ship, especially if that is 50 hours in frustration and agony, is it worth it? In the case of the DoY mission, the answer seems to be a clear no, when I listen to people.

I was overseas for a while, so I couldn't have done DoY, but WoWS will not suck me into these missions anymore.
 

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11 minutes ago, icy_phoenix said:

Ermmm....

TL;DR; anyone?

Event sucks, the bait to force open our wallets just not worth the trouble... try to make events more fun & worth the time spent instead of prioritizing to remove every single cent from what's left of your playerbase WG. :cap_old:

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6 hours ago, MyFranTheDevil said:

Event sucks, the bait to force open our wallets just not worth the trouble... try to make events more fun & worth the time spent instead of prioritizing to remove every single cent from what's left of your playerbase WG. :cap_old:

Oh so basically what we have been asking for since ARP collaboration.

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39 minutes ago, icy_phoenix said:

Oh so basically what we have been asking for since ARP collaboration.

Yeap~ WG just ignored every feedback as usual, that DoY & Haifuri events probably made quite a few whales wiser but is it enough to let WG feel the burn... Lunar New Year is coming so let's see how low WG can go hokay? :cap_win:

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