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A message from the Aus NZ clans to wargaming staff concerning clan wars..

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[1NATN]
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You have lost me as a customer.

I've played WG games for years now and have spent my last cent for your racist company.

Denying the Aus NZ clans the chance to play CW's is the single worst decision WG have ever made and people should be fired because of it.

It simply isn't good enough you money grabbing [content removed] and i'm tired of it.

Don't ever send another WG staffer to this country or stage another PAX event here,you're not welcome.

 

Insults toward Admins/GMs/Mods. Post edited, user sanctioned.

~amade

Edited by amade

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[SGC]
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I'm in East Coast Australia and really enjoying clan battles, CB time is 11pm - 2am which i understand might be late for some people but surely you can stay up until midnight Cinderella and get a few games in...

 

You do realise the player population for Aus/NZ is WAAAY lower than mid Asia region.. and yet you want WG to focus clan battles time around you. Your entitlement is beyond me.

 

WG have said they will review clan battle times for next season based on feedback, so i suggest you put your dummy back in your mouth and provide them with constructive feedback.. not this dummy spit tantrum.

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[1NATN]
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4 minutes ago, KillStealz said:

I'm in East Coast Australia and really enjoying clan battles, CB time is 11pm - 2am which i understand might be late for some people but surely you can stay up until midnight Cinderella and get a few games in...

 

You do realise the player population for Aus/NZ is WAAAY lower than mid Asia region.. and yet you want WG to focus clan battles time around you. Your entitlement is beyond me.

 

WG have said they will review clan battle times for next season based on feedback, so i suggest you put your dummy back in your mouth and provide them with constructive feedback.. not this dummy spit tantrum.

Respectfully, feedback has been provided and summarily ignored. They had two years to get this right and it's unfathomable that they got it so wrong.

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[SGC]
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They can never please everyone, no matter what CB time they come up with... so do you think they should work it around the majority of players or the minority.

 

Based on your reply's you think the minority... logic!

 

Try to be a bit understanding of the whole situation, i have a feeling they will try slightly earlier times next season but will be 9-10pm start best case.

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[AUSNZ]
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Honestly I don't think any of us are expecting for the start time to be lowered to 6pm Eastern as we understand how low the population will be at that time but lower it enough so that the players on the Eastern seaboard can stay up late enough to get some games in while not destroying themselves for work the next day. 

 

Or just changing one of the days to Friday a day that we can all stay up late enough to have a good session.

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[MEGA]
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might as well write out which Aus/NZ clans you are representing, the NA/EU guys rounded up about... like 30~clans from all the servers to protest against the low max number of people in a clan before the CW started, if you manage to gather enough people/clans WG might(i doubt it) get off their lazy arse and get somthing done

 

that being said WG prob still dont give a shit anyways, so meh

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4 hours ago, Bob778_ said:

Honestly I don't think any of us are expecting for the start time to be lowered to 6pm Eastern as we understand how low the population will be at that time but lower it enough so that the players on the Eastern seaboard can stay up late enough to get some games in while not destroying themselves for work the next day. 

 

Or just changing one of the days to Friday a day that we can all stay up late enough to have a good session.

 

In Sydney right now, clan battles are between 11pm and 2am.

 

Pretty painful for every night clan battles are on except Saturday night. On more than than one occasion I've had to go to work running on coffee and feeling like crap. 

 

Adding an extra hour ahead of the prime time would be really super helpful for all of us Aussies (I.e. 10pm to 2am AEST/ADST) 

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4 hours ago, KillStealz said:

They can never please everyone, no matter what CB time they come up with... so do you think they should work it around the majority of players or the minority.

 

Based on your reply's you think the minority... logic!

 

Try to be a bit understanding of the whole situation, i have a feeling they will try slightly earlier times next season but will be 9-10pm start best case.


I understand the situation perfectly and no I don't expect them to cater to a minority. I expect them to cater to their whole player base, not just those who have the greater population. You say it's entitlement. Tell me, if I spend the same amount of money as player X in Japan, am I not entitled to the same experience?

My answer would be to not exclude anyone. There's no need to move the time slot, just expand it. The reasons against expanding the time zone are not sufficient to exclude AU and NZ players from participating.

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WG: I don’t care about AU & NZ players since most of our players (profit) come from East Asia.

WG: We don’t care about small groups of player. Hey Aussies! Just learn from CV player who doesn’t have a chance to speak because the other players don’t like them LOL.

WG: I don’t care about clan wars, it’s just part of the event, the only purpose of it is to show those players who have already reached T10 that the game is still improving=D For example we have the collection mission, how about that?

WG: you guys have no bargaining power at all =], LOL Please Please learn from the Public Test, how dare you to report our premium ship is too overpower! We are going to BUFF it!

 

Lastly: want to know which country has been most taken care of? Look at the main page of the forum, on your right hand side, and look at the WG Staff Posts. What? U want posts in your language updated as fast as the others? Don’t worry about that because we don’t care =D

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[ANZAC]
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I went to the WG gathering event a couple of weeks ago in Auckland. Just to give you guys an insight into  WGs awareness 

 

When I raised the time issue with the WG rep, he had NO IDEA  that this was an issue. He actually thought I was confused. 

There have been enough posts on this, butI'll say it again, I'm not renewing my prem account when it runs out unless things change. I know the ANZ numbers aren't high, but I wonder how the average $$$ spend per player for ANZ compares with other countries on the Asia server. I'd bet its quite high.

 

 

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[1AN-E]
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4 hours ago, j0e90 said:

I went to the WG gathering event a couple of weeks ago in Auckland. Just to give you guys an insight into  WGs awareness 

 

When I raised the time issue with the WG rep, he had NO IDEA  that this was an issue. He actually thought I was confused. 

There have been enough posts on this, butI'll say it again, I'm not renewing my prem account when it runs out unless things change. I know the ANZ numbers aren't high, but I wonder how the average $$$ spend per player for ANZ compares with other countries on the Asia server. I'd bet its quite high.

 

 

 

Dear Wargaming

I'm with j0e90 ... I am not spending a penny more on your product unless and until you demonstrate some commitment to the ANZ region. 

You may call it a dummy spit, or say I should consider your situation. I say that I am a consumer, using a product, and I am entitled to expect a level of consideration from any supplier, and to vote with my feet and my wallet if any supplier doesn't please me.

And Wargaming, you have very badly failed to please me and my clan mates, who have been promised clan wars for two years by WG. To be clear, I do not propose to play the game if CB will never be available to me at realistic times and days. That's the feature that I was looking forward to, like many others in this region. That's why I have been supporting the game for two years, like many others in this region. 

Now it is clear to me that you knew, before deciding to limit the CB window, that the prime time window would effectively prevent ANZ players from enjoying CB. You chose to impose the prime time window anyway. But let's assume against all odds that you had no idea that the prime time window would be unwelcome to ANZ players.

Once the prime time window was launched, ANZ players were immediately strong in their negative feedback. We were told you rely on data, and we were asked to complete a survey. We spent our time doing this. More than 50% of us - scores of us - asked for the earliest time. Less than 3% of us asked for the prime time window that you had imposed. But we are now told that there are not enough of us, so you will not change the prime time window. Why? Because there are more players in Japan and they prefer the current times. So why bother making us complete a survey at all, if you are going to ignore it once you have made all of us waste our time completing the survey? Just so you can insult us, by telling us how unimportant we are to you?

Wargaming, if you want time, attention, support and money from ANZ players, and I assume you do want at least our money, then you need to do a better job of showing, or at least faking, interest in what ANZ players want. Because right now, you are really making a laughing stock of yourself through the ANZ region, based on the posts in this forum. And you seem to be driving me and many previously committed players to other sources of entertainment.

You do have a small window of opportunity to communicate with us your intentions to rectify this error of judgment. It's a matter for you now. 

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[1AN-E]
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1 minute ago, captain_scarlet said:

Wargaming never listen to Ausiie and NZ players - YOU ARE WASTING YOUR BREATH

 

No, I am politely providing consumer feedback to a supplier, before making a consumer purchasing decision. But thanks for your input, I am sure you meant to be helpful

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3 minutes ago, LargerNeptune3 said:

 

No, I am politely providing consumer feedback to a supplier, before making a consumer purchasing decision. But thanks for your input, I am sure you meant to be helpful

 

May be it's not my place to speak, but I just want to point out a major flaw in your demands, and some others above. You people are spending on a game that is advertised as "Free to play". It means, the company never wants your money, and you spend here totally voluntarily for their virtual goodies for whatever points those are sold. None of those will ever say, "Spend money here so that we will hear you". If you want to confront them on that ground, WG will literally tell you that they never asked for you to spend, it was completely your decision. So, it would be better if you guys can stop bringing in the "Hurr durr I spent money so listen to me or else...." attitude. It is not adding anymore weight to the argument. You spend money for a ship, you get the ship, that ends there. Also, "Listen to me or I leave the game" is kinda aggressive. Im not sure it can achieve anything either.

Instead, what you guys should do is collect all the players together and contact directly, like players on NA server did. Realistically thinking, AUS/NZ region does not have many clans, so you will eventually have to wait for other clans to appear as your clan goes up the ladder to higher stages even though the prime time starts from an hour or two earlier. The idea of a smaller primetime window was to ensure team availability I think. Not saying they selected the best timing. You guys are really in a odd timezone. I have the same issue, by the time I leave my work, the primetime is almost finished. Now, you see, I probably spent more than most of you here already, but that's not the point.

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7 minutes ago, icy_phoenix said:

 

May be it's not my place to speak, but I just want to point out a major flaw in your demands, and some others above. You people are spending on a game that is advertised as "Free to play". It means, the company never wants your money, and you spend here totally voluntarily for their virtual goodies for whatever points those are sold. None of those will ever say, "Spend money here so that we will hear you". If you want to confront them on that ground, WG will literally tell you that they never asked for you to spend, it was completely your decision. So, it would be better if you guys can stop bringing in the "Hurr durr I spent money so listen to me or else...." attitude. It is not adding anymore weight to the argument. You spend money for a ship, you get the ship, that ends there. Also, "Listen to me or I leave the game" is kinda aggressive. Im not sure it can achieve anything either.

Instead, what you guys should do is collect all the players together and contact directly, like players on NA server did. Realistically thinking, AUS/NZ region does not have many clans, so you will eventually have to wait for other clans to appear as your clan goes up the ladder to higher stages even though the prime time starts from an hour or two earlier. The idea of a smaller primetime window was to ensure team availability I think. Not saying they selected the best timing. You guys are really in a odd timezone. I have the same issue, by the time I leave my work, the primetime is almost finished. Now, you see, I probably spent more than most of you here already, but that's not the point.

well, someone actually did a good essay about what is in my mind

 

"You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time."

Edited by Harpoon01

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[1AN-E]
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12 minutes ago, icy_phoenix said:

 

May be it's not my place to speak, but I just want to point out a major flaw in your demands, and some others above. You people are spending on a game that is advertised as "Free to play". It means, the company never wants your money, and you spend here totally voluntarily for their virtual goodies for whatever points those are sold. None of those will ever say, "Spend money here so that we will hear you". If you want to confront them on that ground, WG will literally tell you that they never asked for you to spend, it was completely your decision. So, it would be better if you guys can stop bringing in the "Hurr durr I spent money so listen to me or else...." attitude. It is not adding anymore weight to the argument. You spend money for a ship, you get the ship, that ends there. Also, "Listen to me or I leave the game" is kinda aggressive. Im not sure it can achieve anything either.

Instead, what you guys should do is collect all the players together and contact directly, like players on NA server did. Realistically thinking, AUS/NZ region does not have many clans, so you will eventually have to wait for other clans to appear as your clan goes up the ladder to higher stages even though the prime time starts from an hour or two earlier. The idea of a smaller primetime window was to ensure team availability I think. Not saying they selected the best timing. You guys are really in a odd timezone. I have the same issue, by the time I leave my work, the primetime is almost finished. Now, you see, I probably spent more than most of you here already, but that's not the point.

Appreciate the thoughts, and tone, thanks for the input.

I agree a more unified call would be a good idea. Will see what can be done.

But the "free to play" card isn't worth playing: WG clearly need players to play and pay, or they can't exist as a business. Moreover, it's clear that clan players are much more likely to be higher spending customers compared to "free to play" customers, who don't provide money to WG. So it is very much in WG's interest to keep and grow the number of clan players.Also, it's wrong to characterise what we are posting as "demands". We are disgruntled consumers, who have been promised something for two years, during which we were asked to spend money on the product (to help it keep developing), and now have been told we can't have the thing we all wanted so much, which made us keep supporting the product. We are "demanding" nothing more than what we were promised. During that time, we spent a lot of currency ingame. Wargaming wants to keep getting our currency, I assume. I want to get the thing I was promised. Doesn't seem unreasonable to me at all. 

Edited by LargerNeptune3

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2 hours ago, Harpoon01 said:

"You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time."

Well, since clanwar is somewhat competitive in nature. its also about commitment and sacrifice

the more competitive clan (or player) were, the more likely they willing to make sacrifice (like sleep time, study time or family time) and commited to achive something

 

maybe they should have extended prime time at lower league to mid tier league.

while mid to high tier league were moved to be middle point where compromise time betwen most of regions can be made.

so at least everyone can be halfway sattisfied

Edited by humusz

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17 hours ago, KillStealz said:

I'm in East Coast Australia and really enjoying clan battles, CB time is 11pm - 2am which i understand might be late for some people but surely you can stay up until midnight Cinderella and get a few games in...

 

You do realise the player population for Aus/NZ is WAAAY lower than mid Asia region.. and yet you want WG to focus clan battles time around you. Your entitlement is beyond me.

 

WG have said they will review clan battle times for next season based on feedback, so i suggest you put your dummy back in your mouth and provide them with constructive feedback.. not this dummy spit tantrum.

I'm glad you're enjoying clan wars.

 

Unfortunately the start time here in NZ which u might not realise is 1am start.

 

So I would turn into a pumpkin by then.

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21 hours ago, KillStealz said:

They can never please everyone, no matter what CB time they come up with... so do you think they should work it around the majority of players or the minority.

 

Based on your reply's you think the minority... logic!

 

Try to be a bit understanding of the whole situation, i have a feeling they will try slightly earlier times next season but will be 9-10pm start best case.

 

Would be nice if WG could extend the CBs 2 hours earlier. This will give NZ and AU players a proper window.

 

Only reason I think WG dont is because of the rewards. The bigger the window the more games clans will play. 

 

Lets just say WG is tight. They dont want to hand out the rewards easily. But then even if the window is expanded clans still need to do well to make it to typhoon league. Unless its a positive sum game where eventually everyone will get there just by spamming games.

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[1AN-E]
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22 hours ago, KillStealz said:

I'm in East Coast Australia and really enjoying clan battles, CB time is 11pm - 2am which i understand might be late for some people but surely you can stay up until midnight Cinderella and get a few games in...

 

You do realise the player population for Aus/NZ is WAAAY lower than mid Asia region.. and yet you want WG to focus clan battles time around you. Your entitlement is beyond me.

 

WG have said they will review clan battle times for next season based on feedback, so i suggest you put your dummy back in your mouth and provide them with constructive feedback.. not this dummy spit tantrum.

The best that WG have said is Sub_Ovtavian's reddit post, which says changing prime is "an option" - but he had just told us that it is not being changed now because Japanese players outnumber ANZ regional players, and the prime suits the JP customers of Wargaming so that's what Wargaming are going with - so what is going to change about that next season?

 

And why is this happening at all, after two years' of experience with the ANZ region's needs? You say, because there are more players in the mid Asia region. I say, because Wargaming has failed to address customer issues that were identified very clearly with Team Battles, and other issues we have had over the past two years. I haven't even mentioned the WoT experiences that Wargaming has had in the region, but that would also be a hint for them ...

 

Also, there are more than a few people who start work earlier than you appear to have to get up, and they are extra rooted by the prime - your lack of empathy is beyond me. Have a nice day :)

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8 minutes ago, SlamUez said:

Only reason I think WG dont is because of the rewards. The bigger the window the more games clans will play. 

 

Lets just say WG is tight. They dont want to hand out the rewards easily. But then even if the window is expanded clans still need to do well to make it to typhoon league. Unless its a positive sum game where eventually everyone will get there just by spamming games.

That sounds more believable than what we have been told so far. I would understand if there is an internal WG reward budget for the event, and they are concerned it will be exceeded if more than X clans achieve Y rewards. But there is a better way to keep within a reward budget, than exclude so many players. What a shame WG didn't think about this before they committed to the prime time window, and what a pity they now seem to be doubling down on it

 

Btw, I think CB might be a kinda positive sum game - once a clan achieves all the League rewards, they are playing CB just for bragging rights - Flamu mentioned it in one of his CB streams - so you would expect some to stop playing, leaving space for others to also achieve the same League rewards ... but you can't get the rewards just by spamming games, because you need wins

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[1AN-E]
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On 11/6/2017 at 2:35 AM, humusz said:

Well, since clanwar is somewhat competitive in nature. its also about commitment and sacrifice

the more competitive clan (or player) were, the more likely they willing to make sacrifice (like sleep time, study time or family time) and commited to achive something

 

maybe they should have extended prime time at lower league to mid tier league.

while mid to high tier league were moved to be middle point where compromise time betwen most of regions can be made.

so at least everyone can be halfway sattisfied

That sounds like a really good compromise humusz - it should satisfy more than half too, because so many clans are in the lower Leagues compared to the higher ones ... hope WG are listening 

UPDATE on 19 December 2017:

You know, thinking about this, it seems inherently unfair to say that some players MUST make sacrifices, like you say,  and this is SOLELY because of their location, while players in other locations do NOT need to make any of those sacrifices, again SOLELY because of their location. That is arbitrarily imposing unfairness onto some players, but not others, based SOLELY on their location. Seems inherently unfair to me. 

As I thought about this, and why your post didn't seem entirely right to me, I realised that your stated assumption is almost totally wrong.

I think Clan Battles is NOT about sacrifice and commitment at all, as you have said. Rather, I think it is a feature of a video game that has been promised for two years, and is aimed at allowing groups of players, who play together in a clan, to play against other groups of players who also play together in a clan.

You have elevated the whole thing to the level of a real world navy, in which no doubt there are real sacrifices called for. But WoWS is not a real navy, it is a video game. People play WoWs for entertainment and to socialise, not to save lives or defend any real nation.

So I don't think that it is reasonable for WG to require some players, but not others, to sacrifice sleep etc - just to enjoy this feature we've been promised for two years.

So why not require the same sacrifices from other players? I can understand the issue of regional player numbers is the problem. That problem needs a solution.

Unfortunately,  Wargaming has chosen a solution which is biased/weighted against players in the affected time zones, but not players in other time zones. 

This doesn't make it fair or reasonable, it just makes it the solution Wargaming chose to implement, and as many have agreed in this forum, it is a solution which effectively imposes extra burdens on those players who are in the affected time zones, while not doing the same to the players who are not in the affected time zones. So that makes it a biased solution.

Again, I just can't understand how Wargaming can keep on doing and saying nothing about this problem. It clearly needs to be addressed, and before the start of the next season of clan battles, or there is going to be an exodus away from this game by players in the affected time zones.

Of course, that's something which Wargaming might be fine about, as is their right. But it doesn't make their chosen solution fair or reasonable, or unbiased.

And by saying nothing back to the MANY people asking for a real solution, Wargaming have made the problem worse, and actually created another problem - a perception that they are prejudiced against players in this region. You can see it in the OP's post ... he is clearly sick and tired of feeling that players in the ANZ regions are being treated poorly by Wargaming, and he seems to have let his anger get the better of his expression, but he's far from the only poster in this forum that I have seen have that kind of a brain explosion, for exactly the same reason.

Bottom line: unless Wargaming are fools, which I don't expect to be the case, they need to get on top of this ANZ regional support issue as they are trying to do for WoT, otherwise WoWS will die in these regions, from lack of player support - because us players will be going elsewhere to play other publishers' games - games which DO allow clans to battle each other at reasonable times, even if the players are in the ANZ regions

Edited by LargerNeptune3

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