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keskparane

I need a rant. DD's spot & cap uncontested caps please. Oh, and learn to work together.

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Why do dd's want cruisers or bb to spot enemy dd for them? Why when we have 3 v 2 dd's do they not send 1 to each cap, thereby practically guaranteeing 1 uncontested cap?

 

I seem to have been on a lot of teams lately where the dd's on are always second line. If they do happen to somehow stumble upon an enemy dd they will usually smoke up, thereby hiding the enemy from view of all and preventing anyone from being able to target them. They will then promptly fall back while the team takes a wave of unspotted torps.

 

If there are many dd's they will usually pair up in the worst way. Like the 2 dd's with best concealment will go to the same cap and leave the poor tashkent or similar by themselves.

 

If by some fluke you get a pairing of say kagero and tashkent then the kagero will smoke up and expect the tashkent to spot for him.

 

I don't expect anything to come of this. It's just a rant to let of some steam. /rant 

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[ATLAS]
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>Kagerou

>Going alone

I'm pretty sure that's a death wish right there

 

Also I don't blame initial smoke since perhaps both of them spot each other and both of them got their team behind them to shoot, expecting initial DD engagement to went directly into one side favour is a harder than asking a genie to give a gf

 

 

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Why do dd's want cruisers or bb to spot enemy dd for them? Why when we have 3 v 2 dd's do they not send 1 to each cap, thereby practically guaranteeing 1 uncontested cap?

 

I seem to have been on a lot of teams lately where the dd's on are always second line. If they do happen to somehow stumble upon an enemy dd they will usually smoke up, thereby hiding the enemy from view of all and preventing anyone from being able to target them. They will then promptly fall back while the team takes a wave of unspotted torps.

 

If there are many dd's they will usually pair up in the worst way. Like the 2 dd's with best concealment will go to the same cap and leave the poor tashkent or similar by themselves.

 

If by some fluke you get a pairing of say kagero and tashkent then the kagero will smoke up and expect the tashkent to spot for him.

 

I don't expect anything to come of this. It's just a rant to let of some steam. /rant 

Recently I have seen a huge drop in the quality of DD players regardless of tier. But in my case, it is usually some DD that charge straight into cap and knife fight without considering how much support he has and die too early rather than hanging back.

>Kagerou

>Going alone

I'm pretty sure that's a death wish right there

 

Also I don't blame initial smoke since perhaps both of them spot each other and both of them got their team behind them to shoot, expecting initial DD engagement to went directly into one side favour is a harder than asking a genie to give a gf

 

 

It depends on how the smoke is used imo. In OP's case, it is very likely that the Kagero instantly pops up panic smoke when the enemy DD appears. Smoke shouldn't be used unless you are exposed to losing more than 20% of HP, even if you are IJN DD vs USN DD.

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[ATLAS]
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Recently I have seen a huge drop in the quality of DD players regardless of tier. But in my case, it is usually some DD that charge straight into cap and knife fight without considering how much support he has and die too early rather than hanging back.

It depends on how the smoke is used imo. In OP's case, it is very likely that the Kagero instantly pops up panic smoke when the enemy DD appears. Smoke shouldn't be used unless you are exposed to losing more than 20% of HP, even if you are IJN DD vs USN DD.

 

It is initial engagement, It's less IJN DD vs USN DD and more of front most DD gets 4+ counter on their SA if they take it. They will lose their life if they don't smoke ASAP no matter what DD you are. It's getting worse for the DD who fire their guns because it means he have to smoke too when the enemy DD smoked already because detection penalty means another DD or something else at other direction could have spotted them 

 

 

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>Kagerou

>Going alone

I'm pretty sure that's a death wish right there

 

Also I don't blame initial smoke since perhaps both of them spot each other and both of them got their team behind them to shoot, expecting initial DD engagement to went directly into one side favour is a harder than asking a genie to give a gf

 

 

 

I disagree. Kagero has good conceal. All they have to do is spot enemy dd and stay unspotted while team fires. Especially when they have a gunboat dd with them who can pop smoke and start firing. 

 

As for that initial smoke you speak of. They should plan it so they don't conceal the enemy from their team. Hiding the enemy (cruisers and bb included) from your team because you panic is bad play in my opinion.

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>Kagerou

>Going alone

I'm pretty sure that's a death wish right there

 

Also I don't blame initial smoke since perhaps both of them spot each other and both of them got their team behind them to shoot, expecting initial DD engagement to went directly into one side favour is a harder than asking a genie to give a gf

 

 

 

I saw many times, Kagero/Mahan stay behind CA and BB, no cap, no spot. Extremely useless

I wish I have a nuke

Edited by MatterCore

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Cuz it's asia, u know… When people talk all kinds of languages and squares, it's hard to communicate and co-op.

 

Just seems logical to me. If you can explain a better reasoning to leave a cap uncontested when 3 v 2 dd then I would be happy to hear it. So I consider that it needs no communication. Just go to appropriate cap based on starting location.

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[LNA]
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Because everyone afraid of going alone where no one will shoot enemy dd for ya.

Right now IJN dd is in a very bad shape as they have to avoid contact with almost all enemy ships and go jerking off somewhere instead of prowling the cap like a US or VMF dd.

Anyway know  Pikachu ? This is the syndrome where a pissed off Pika Pi will fry the entire team because someone step on its tail :trollface:

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it really depends on the enemy cruisers, really. will never cap until i can ascertain the position of the enemy radar cruisers. capping with the threat of getting radared is a free kill for the enemy team.

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I disagree. Kagero has good conceal. All they have to do is spot enemy dd and stay unspotted while team fires. Especially when they have a gunboat dd with them who can pop smoke and start firing. 

 

As for that initial smoke you speak of. They should plan it so they don't conceal the enemy from their team. Hiding the enemy (cruisers and bb included) from your team because you panic is bad play in my opinion.

 

And that good concealment can be a bad thing too. Enemy Kagerou get the exact same concealment and at that range, USN DDs doesn't get their rainbow arcs.

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And that good concealment can be a bad thing too. Enemy Kagerou get the exact same concealment and at that range, USN DDs doesn't get their rainbow arcs.

 

So you suggest don't contest the cap and just let them have it if they have a Kagero and a USN DD on their team? In other words DD's should never get spotted the entire game and just fire torps from the second line? I'm not trying to be argumentative. I genuinely would like to know if their is a better option than spotting the enemy and contesting caps. As I read what your saying; first into a cap gets it and it should never be contested from there. However that would bring back to my point about going to each cap at the start if 3 or more dd.

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And how do you contest the cap if you can't see the enemy DDs? It doesn't give XP to just sit in cap and stall the bar either.

And then you get those DDs that get outspotted by the USN DDs at tier 8 and 9, what do you want them to do? Sail in and get shot by everyone on the enemy team because they're public enemy no. 1?

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And how do you contest the cap if you can't see the enemy DDs? It doesn't give XP to just sit in cap and stall the bar either.

And then you get those DDs that get outspotted by the USN DDs at tier 8 and 9, what do you want them to do? Sail in and get shot by everyone on the enemy team because they're public enemy no. 1?

 

So you're suggesting that cruisers and bb should spot and cap? :child:
Edited by keskparane

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I disagree. Kagero has good conceal. All they have to do is spot enemy dd and stay unspotted while team fires. Especially when they have a gunboat dd with them who can pop smoke and start firing. 

 

As for that initial smoke you speak of. They should plan it so they don't conceal the enemy from their team. Hiding the enemy (cruisers and bb included) from your team because you panic is bad play in my opinion.

 

But you said you want that DD to go to the uncontested cap which means you want that Kagerou to go alone from the start which means if there's enemy there, she can't run because 34 knot top speed which means she's dead and just gave away points to the enemy team

 

Initial engagement is that one at first two minutes, your DD come into the cap, enemy DD might or might not get into the cap to contest it. If one of them spot each other, both team gonna be alerted and quite possibly f3 that DD. Because they most likely will smoke the cap area, go into a position where your LoS won't be blocked by his smoke, or maybe use your planes.

 

If it's not initial engagement forget about what I said and freely report your DD

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But you said you want that DD to go to the uncontested cap which means you want that Kagerou to go alone from the start which means if there's enemy there, she can't run because 34 knot top speed which means she's dead and just gave away points to the enemy team

 

Initial engagement is that one at first two minutes, your DD come into the cap, enemy DD might or might not get into the cap to contest it. If one of them spot each other, both team gonna be alerted and quite possibly f3 that DD. Because they most likely will smoke the cap area, go into a position where your LoS won't be blocked by his smoke, or maybe use your planes.

 

If it's not initial engagement forget about what I said and freely report your DD

You have ruled out Kagero as being capable of spotting. Please tell me which dd's are capable of spotting in wows.

 

I would not report a dd for smoking or dying in the front line. I might if they spend the match second line.

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One gives XP, the other one doesn't.

 

That's right. So the perfect match is everyone not getting shot. It's called a stalemate. Basically what you do is everyone just sits at base at the start and no one moves.

 

Or the one person in the game with the best dd can individually cap each point. Then they can spot the other team and their bb with longest range can fire shots at the spotted targets. Everyone else should just try and avoid being seen. /sarcasm

 

I think your suggestion that people should avoid any chance of being shot defeats the game entirely.

 

 

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If by some fluke you get a pairing of say kagero and tashkent then the kagero will smoke up and expect the tashkent to spot for him.

DD supposed to fight caps and kill other DDs. Simple and easy.

Never trust IJN DD, never put any hope on them.

They are very funny, they know they can't win caps, they know they can't win ship engagements, they know they can't escape from CV attacks and they continue their journey in IJNDD and ruin 11 other players day.

If MM put bunch of those guys in your team... mostly auto lose.

Only USN and KM DD could be your savior.

Edited by R3negade

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I think there are some some correct elements in this discussion here, I too have seen DDs lately going in for knife fights rather than cap, I think they want the glory of destroying BBs rather than do what they are supposed to do, which is cap, stalk, surprise & support. .

Too many these days are turning into rambos, & getting their faces punched in as a result, therefore making the team lose the match by not being afloat to cap.

 

These are the DD players that let their team down.

 

As for smoke, yes the DDs these days just put smoke everywhere as soon as they are spotted.. when they do that, you know that that DD is just looking for glory kills & is not there to help the team, he just wants the cherrys & not the whole cake...

 

When I play my ships, I look at the map & the ship's, & see where my type of ship is needed, & what type of ships to target, I don't just go for glory kills, & when I do that, I find my play style improves, & I contribute positively to the whole team, even if I get sunk.

 

As for smoke, I actually think the British cruiser smoke is more dangerous, because there's usually a cruiser in there, with he that cooks you, & torpedoes to fillet you... 

 

Ordrazz 

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Yep the game has changed in the higher tiers, Cruisers with the capabilities to spot DD's upto 9kms away even in smoke makes it a free kill for them.  I think the game has changed in that almost its the Cruisers who can CAP areas .... and run away, if pushed back.  With a DD getting spotted by 3 Cruisers is instant death, you smoke, no good you WASP hack no good cause they are fast firing ships and they have big impact on them.  IJN DD T8 and above are in really bad shape, so much i sold my Yugumo as i just cannot cap with it even with 5.5 CE enabled and you cannot fire with its guns unless you are miles away with very little impact and the torps get spotted with all the tools these Cruisers have so you basically might get a hit or two but you cannot sink anything.   If you can get to the LATER into the game with the DD like this, then you can make an impact on the game and you can start to attack BB with some good effect.  Early in the game these guys are basically useless, however by this stage one side has all the CAPs and the game is already decided.

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DD supposed to fight caps and kill other DDs. Simple and easy.

Never trust IJN DD, never put any hope on them.

They are very funny, they know they can't win caps, they know they can't win ship engagements, they know they can't escape from CV attacks and they continue their journey in IJNDD and ruin 11 other players day.

If MM put bunch of those guys in your team... mostly auto lose.

Only USN and KM DD could be your savior.

 

This is exactly the problem with IJN DD's, but its not just the knife fights with other DD's its the fast moving, unbelievable detection tools of the Cruisers and if they are in a PACK .... all DD's get killed very quickly.  A team of 3 Cruisers,like 3 Zao's/Neptune's will sink 4 DD's in less than a minute.  There is no point in capping a ZONE when these guys are your opponents.

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Games are usually won by how good the DD captain is. Though getting constant 2 vs 3 or 3 vs 4 DDs imbalance MM does get tiring sometimes.

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DDs are only as good at capping as their support is.  If everyone is busy trying to burn that on BB at the back of the map and not helping the DDs by giving the enemy CAs (and DDs) something else to think about then you have no chance of getting a DD to cap.

 

Way too often I've gone to the cap with half the team behind me and not one shot on the CAs harrassing me.

I've gotten to the stage now, where if the CAs first shots are at a BB then I bail out of the cap fight and go solo hunting.

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