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Karrick

Please fix the british cruiser smoke bug

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Please fix the british cruiser smoke bug.

 

I have just lost three games - two as Edinburgh and one with the Fiji.

 

Slowed down, popped the smoke, came to a stop, and sitting out in the open as the smoke didnt pop the second time.

 

Sadly I dont record my games, as lets face it, who wants to see my potato gameplay.

 

However, here is some more sarcastic/better players showing clearly that the bug exists.

 

 

 

The British line was rushed out, and clearly this broken smoke mechanic is a result of the rush. FIX IT PLEASE WG.

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Yup. I've pretty much given up relying on that 2nd puff, so I make sure I am doing less than 15 kn. Allegedly there is a 'sweet spot' speed of I think 18 kn that will give you 2 puffs always.

Flamu pretty much sums it up perfectly.

Edited by j0e90

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Yup. I've pretty much given up relying on that 2nd puff, so I make sure I am doing less than 15 kn. Allegedly there is a 'sweet spot' speed of I think 18 kn that will give you 2 puffs always.

Flamu pretty much sums it up perfectly.

 

^^^^  He is right.... Sweet spot to pop up the smoke is when you are slowing down and your speed dial shows that you are 18kts.... anything before that lands you out of the smoke... It is not a bug actually it is the skill that is needed...

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Super Tester
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Please fix the british cruiser smoke bug.

 

I have just lost three games - two as Edinburgh and one with the Fiji.

 

Slowed down, popped the smoke, came to a stop, and sitting out in the open as the smoke didnt pop the second time.

 

Sadly I dont record my games, as lets face it, who wants to see my potato gameplay.

 

However, here is some more sarcastic/better players showing clearly that the bug exists.

 

 

 

The British line was rushed out, and clearly this broken smoke mechanic is a result of the rush. FIX IT PLEASE WG.

 

Clearly NOT really a bug.

Your ship speed have to be lower than ~11knts to create extra buff at the last second of smoke deployment

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[MEGA]
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Clearly NOT really a bug.

Your ship speed have to be lower than ~11knts to create extra buff at the last second of smoke deployment

it is a bug R3, it only happens when the ship is going at 28-23 knots, above or below you get 2-3 puffs, but not at 28-23

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Yep totally agree i've stopped playing my Belfast because of this,it needs to fixed and i aint whinging its a glitch that needs to be fixed pronto!

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it is a bug R3, it only happens when the ship is going at 28-23 knots, above or below you get 2-3 puffs, but not at 28-23

 

Did you look into the duration of smoke being laid?? it doesn't work like DD's smoke where DD can lay a huge line of smoke.... If I'm not wrong duration of laying smoke is somewhere around 3-4secs for which you need to be at a certain decreasing velocity of 18kts... popping smoke before that period will end you right out of the smoke...

 

It takes skill to lay smoke on RN CLs... And I'm damn well sure it is not a bug.

Edited by Aaditya_AJ

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Did you look into the duration of smoke being laid?? it doesn't work like DD's smoke where DD can lay a huge line of smoke.... If I'm not wrong duration of laying smoke is somewhere around 3-4secs for which you need to be at a certain decreasing velocity of 18kts... popping smoke before that period will end you right out of the smoke...

 

It takes skill to lay smoke on RN CLs... And I'm damn well sure it is not a bug.

This has happened to me at < 15kts and under 10kts. If it's not a bug - what, precisely, do you need to do to get the second puff? I have died several times due to this in Leander, Fiji and Edinburgh. . . I now only use it when I've already stopped. 

Edited by Mister_Teatime

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If you're too fast, you end up outside the 2nd puff. If you're too slow, you won't be far enough from the center of the previous puff for the game to allow you to generate a 2nd puff before the emission duration runs out. Ergo, not a bug.

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Super Tester
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This has happened to me at < 15kts and under 10kts. If it's not a bug - what, precisely, do you need to do to get the second puff? I have died several times due to this in Leander, Fiji and Edinburgh. . . I now only use it when I've already stopped. 

 

it is a bug R3, it only happens when the ship is going at 28-23 knots, above or below you get 2-3 puffs, but not at 28-23

 

Check what Amade said, I can confirm that.

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This has happened to me at < 15kts and under 10kts. If it's not a bug - what, precisely, do you need to do to get the second puff? I have died several times due to this in Leander, Fiji and Edinburgh. . . I now only use it when I've already stopped. 

 

*sigh* then why does it work for me everytime????? I'm I running different game from you or Did WG made my game special???

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Beta Tester
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it happen to me couple of time few day ago. smoke generates only one puff instead of usually 2. clearly it a but because smoke generates two puff if you are on max speed but it only happened when you are at 14 to 18ish knots.

 

i played tonnes of RN cruiser already so i know the right speed and timing when slowing down to pop smoke and the cruiser will stop just where the 2nd pop of smoke. but there are odd times here there are only one pop of smoke.

 

just like flamu said, if its really working as intended. then the 2nd pop of smoke will not be created if the cruiser is on max speed. but it only happened when the ship is at 1/4ish of its speed.

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Clearly NOT really a bug.

Your ship speed have to be lower than ~11knts to create extra buff at the last second of smoke deployment

 

Not true.

 

Watch either video that i posted. Flamu demonstrates that the second puff generated when he was going 27 knots.

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Alright, let me explain another way why this isn't a bug.

 

First, lets keep these things in mind:

  • Smoke will deploy on top of your ship if you're under 12.5 kt
  • Smoke will deploy behind your ship if you're over 12.5 kt
  • Smoke will not deploy if the next puff isn't far enough from the center of the previous puff

 

Now let me demonstrate the 2nd and 3rd bullet points in pictures:

 

Notice how the center of the puffs aren't on the ship's circular path itself? That's because the puff is generated a certain distance directly behind the ship when it's travelling above 12.5 kt. So, during a turn the stern of the ship is pointing away from the path of the ship, so the smoke is deployed at an offset. Below is another image to explain how it's generated:

 

 

So how does this relate to the so called UKCL 2nd smoke puff "bug"?

 

Easy. In order to get the 2nd puff it must be deployed far enough from the center of the first puff. Keeping in mind of the 2nd bullet point, the ship will not have slowed down enough for the puff to generate on top the ship itself, so it will have to deploy it directly behind the ship. However, if the ship hasn't traveled far enough from the first puff, the 2nd puff can't generate as it will be too close to the center of the first puff. So you end up not generating the 2nd puff.

 

QED.

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[ATLAS]
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So why does it generate second puff if you went full speed?

If this supposed to be intended shouldn't you have second puff at all speed asides from super slow one anyway?

Edited by Vio_Strygun

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So why does it generate second puff if you went full speed?

If this supposed to be intended shouldn't you have second puff at all speed anyway?

 

If you're at full speed, you're going fast enough to give room for the second puff to deploy. But in the case of UKCLs, if you slow down too much, you end up not giving it enough room to deploy, and then your smoke emission duration runs out.

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If you're at full speed, you're going fast enough to give room for the second puff to deploy. But in the case of UKCLs, if you slow down too much, you end up not giving it enough room to deploy, and then your smoke emission duration runs out.

 

 

 

 

So I decided to check your theory with my Edinburgh - B hull, rudder mod, no acceleration mod.

 

 

Went to the training room, tried 24, 22, 20, 18, 16 knot smokes (stopped from 28+ knots, press smoke at desired speed range).  24-18 provide dual puffs, entirely reliably, and the ship stops within the second puff entirely reliably.  16 knot provides 1 puff, and the ship stops within the 1 puff.

 

 

I also tried turns, 16 and 18 knots, and in both cases the ship got 1 or 2 puffs as expected and stopped within the puff.  I also tried 18 knots with full astern instead of full stop (a usual thing you might do when trying to smoke stop and shoot), and the ship got 2 puffs and stopped within the second puff, as expected.

 

 

I know from experience over and over again, if I do a 21knot smoke on the live server, I've a great chance of missing out on my second puff with my ship then stopping outside the smoke, even though that is in the middle of the safe 2 puff range I just sampled on the training room - so much so that my usual smoking speed is below 16 knots (and probably why common wisdom says smoke at 12 knots or risk being outside your smoke).

 

 

Its a bug that happens on live match conditions imo.

 

 

Edited by AdmiralJasonB

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Ok, found it, 22-23 knots.


 

In the same session, I then stopped at 20 knots and got a proper 2 puffer.


I tried again, and now its doing it out to 24.5 knots.  These are all speeds which it didn't do during the last session, so all I can imagine is that server + net + client lag meant I was doing my stops from outside the actual required range around 23 knots to average 16-18 during the stop.

 

Ok, tried constant tests with benson and Edinburgh, amade is actually right, its cancelling.  The cancel speed range is any constant speed between 15 and 19 as far as I can tell.  So its a pretty wide average where it will fail.

 


 

TL;dr stop at 19 if you want a 2 puff smoke screen and want to be entirely safe for lag conditions inside it.  Speeds greater than that is asking for random.


 


 


 

 

Edited by AdmiralJasonB

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[MEGA]
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^yes

i know how to play RNCLs, im not a skrub who dunno how/where/when to pop moi smoke, infact i came in 9th in the server in the fiji. im not stat boasting cuz i know that R3 is better then me, i just want to point out that i, a fairly competent player who have had quite a bit of experience with RNCLs, have seen, experienced and suffered from this damn bug, and would REALLY be happy if someone looked into, and fixed this

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^yes

i know how to play RNCLs, im not a skrub who dunno how/where/when to pop moi smoke, infact i came in 9th in the server in the fiji. im not stat boasting cuz i know that R3 is better then me, i just want to point out that i, a fairly competent player who have had quite a bit of experience with RNCLs, have seen, experienced and suffered from this damn bug, and would REALLY be happy if someone looked into, and fixed this

 

 

 

 

Stop or full astern from full speed, pop smoke at 19 and stay full astern or stopped, you won't get the "bug", and you will get 2 smoke puffs, which is the thing you want to give you wiggle room in your smoke to turn to open your arcs, escape or be difficult to hit.

 

 

 

 

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^yes

i know how to play RNCLs, im not a skrub who dunno how/where/when to pop moi smoke, infact i came in 9th in the server in the fiji. im not stat boasting cuz i know that R3 is better then me, i just want to point out that i, a fairly competent player who have had quite a bit of experience with RNCLs, have seen, experienced and suffered from this damn bug, and would REALLY be happy if someone looked into, and fixed this

 

It's not a bug, you simply cannot force the 2nd puff to deploy if it's too close to the first one. If anything, it's a balancing topic, because the devs decide at what speed puffs deploy behind the ship instead of on top of the ship, and at what distance behind the ship it will deploy.

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It's not a bug, you simply cannot force the 2nd puff to deploy if it's too close to the first one. If anything, it's a balancing topic, because the devs decide at what speed puffs deploy behind the ship instead of on top of the ship, and at what distance behind the ship it will deploy.

 

 

 

 

I don't really believe its a balancing issue, because the same behavior is visible in benson smoke.  ie its just a server resources conservation, programming resources conservation or rendering simplification.  ie the brit cruiser smoke was implemented without actual code changes, just parameters in the ship database, and as a result its revealing a server implementation, rather than a gaming mechanic.

 

 

if the mechanic revealed broken smoke where the ship was travelling too fast, and solid smoke where it was travelling more slowly, then it would have been interesting, but as it is, solid smoke when its travelling too fast, followed by failure as it slows down, is just the reverse of what I'd call a believable mechanic, and its the reverse of what a unicum would calculate might occur in their minds, and thus its purely a mechanic that a stodgy puzzler will figure out.  (which is why players like flamu posted videos without figuring it out).  ie its in no way what I'd call "high skill floor".

 

 

Edited by AdmiralJasonB

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I don't really believe its a balancing issue, because the same behavior is visible in benson smoke.  ie its just a server resources conservation, programming resources conservation or rendering simplification.  ie the brit cruiser smoke was implemented without actual code changes, just parameters in the ship database, and as a result its revealing a server implementation, rather than a gaming mechanic.

 

 

if the mechanic revealed broken smoke where the ship was travelling too fast, and solid smoke where it was travelling more slowly, then it would have been interesting, but as it is, solid smoke when its travelling too fast, followed by failure as it slows down, is just the reverse of what I'd call a believable mechanic, and its the reverse of what a unicum would calculate might occur in their minds, and thus its purely a mechanic that a stodgy puzzler will figure out.  (which is why players like flamu posted videos without figuring it out).  ie its in no way what I'd call "high skill floor".

 

I'm pretty certain it's a balancing decision because the 12.5 kt speed was the figure the devs explicitly stated when optimizing smoke deployment so that ships can't easily go invisible while moving. Make the offset distance too short and the ship will blink in an out of smoke like it used to in older versions (which the devs said was undesirable), set the speed threshold higher and the smoke will always cover the ship at medium speeds, making it very abusable. UKCL smoke also has a larger radius than normal smoke, so the offset distance when travelling at speed would also have to be tailored specifically for them to ensure proper spacing.

 

Either way, it's working as intended™, just not necessarily the way players expect it to work.

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It's not a bug, you simply cannot force the 2nd puff to deploy if it's too close to the first one. If anything, it's a balancing topic, because the devs decide at what speed puffs deploy behind the ship instead of on top of the ship, and at what distance behind the ship it will deploy.

 

and how does this explain single puffs being deployed by RN CL traveling at 30kn + ?

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and how does this explain single puffs being deployed by RN CL traveling at 30kn + ?

 

Read the previous page.

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