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Alternate_Rouge

Admiral Graf Spee? please?

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When are we going to get this amazing pocket battleship? I see videos of it in game in north america servers when are we going to get it here in asia?!

Edited by Alternate_Rouge

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Given that the review embargo is done, it's entered the store rotation. None of the servers have it yet for sale yet - only the reviewers got access to a temporary review copy.

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When are we going to get this amazing pocket battleship?

 

"Amazing" indeed.

She was such an "amazing" heavy cruiser that she almost lost to three crappy british cruisers irl.

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"Amazing" indeed.

She was such an "amazing" heavy cruiser that she almost lost to three crappy british cruisers irl.

 

hey its a cruiser with a battleship guns... thats what i call amazing

 

its rich in history

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its rich in history

 

Yeah, I get ya, that rich history of being sunk in 1939 without achieving anything worthwhile.

 

Edit: Sunk by it's own crew of course, like most german ships, that's the Marine for ya, when things turn difficult they run.

Edited by Retia

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Yeah, I get ya, that rich history of being sunk in 1939 without achieving anything worthwhile.

 

Edit: Sunk by it's own crew of course, like most german ships, that's the Marine for ya, when things turn difficult they run.

 

Yeah,and the pommy navy had such a proud history in WW2 does it?Totally overreacting to a vastly outnumbered enemy and using equivalent of fox hunts to get them.Real tough that is.

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I think WG released a rendered picture with Spee painted in the New Year's camo… So probably she will be available soon.

Not in asia probably, as Fujin is in Hallowe'en camo but we got Fujin for the first time almost a entire year after it was released

Edited by _Halcyon

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Sausage is passing through final checks or quality control. No one wants to eat raw sausage.  :trollface:

 

Jokes aside. In store rotation probably or ready for sale (waiting for time)

Edited by Safiuddin97

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Yeah,and the pommy navy had such a proud history in WW2 does it?

 

Better than the german navy which was busy being useless at dealing any significant damage to the british navy.

All while failing to prevent enough supplies from reaching both the UK and UDSSR to stop them from being major opposition.

 

Although I don't give all the fault to the stagnant admirality with it's antique ideas about naval warfare. (After all when did Germany ever care about it's navy?)

It sure didn't help that the german navy had to make use with little funding and a constant ressource shortage,

hence resulting in all ships being jack of all trades that can't do anything well.

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"Amazing" indeed.

She was such an "amazing" heavy cruiser that she almost lost to three crappy british cruisers irl.

Three attacking from 2 sides, and she still wrecks em anyway. Almost lost? What?

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Yeah, I get ya, that rich history of being sunk in 1939 without achieving anything worthwhile.

 

Edit: Sunk by it's own crew of course, like most german ships, that's the Marine for ya, when things turn difficult they run.

She sinks up to 40000 tons of shipments, and make the British navy actually sends some of its fleet to south atlantic. 

 

Sunk by her own crew from the order of her captain. Who wants to save his crew's life. And after he makes sure his crew is safe, he follows his ship. A decision I believe you don't even have the balls to make.

Edited by Admiral_Turing

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Three attacking from 2 sides, and she still wrecks em anyway. Almost lost? What?

 

Took damage from one heavy cruiser and two light cruisers while being vastly superior in terms of firepower, mobility and armor.

Used up most of it's ammunition, lost it's means to traverse high seas safely... and again, against a Yorck and two Leanders...

Literally would've sunk in it's next engagement or if the engagement had continued, at the cost of 1-2 crappy british cruisers, but doh, it's not like the british didn't

have a few more of those.

 

Meanwhile somehow the Glorious and her two destroyers survived hours against Scharnhorst and Gneisenau with the Acasta managing to not only

protect the carrier with her smoke but also score several torpedo hits on Scharnhorst dealing significant damage.

 

Damage that later on put Scharnhorst under intensive threat from the british airforce and pretty much shut her down until much later delaying

the operations Germany had planned with her and Gneisenau.

 

And yes, sending Glorious back to the UK early because her captain was a fool that didn't listen to his officers and wanted to put one of them under military

trial and then also not relaying Glorious' distress call because Cunningham was too scared of losing the norwegian royal family was dumb as cake, but that doesn't

change the fact that the two destroyers escorting her did some real work.

 

She sinks up to 40000 tons of shipments, and make the British navy actually sends some of its fleet to south atlantic.

 

Leaving behind still enough ships to oppose the german navy with it's lacking numbers due to lack of ressources and funding.

 

Sunk by her own crew from the order of her captain. Who wants to save his crew's life. And after he makes sure his crew is safe, he follows his ship. A decision I believe you don't even have the balls to make.

 

He shot himself because that's what you did when you failed like this in Germany of 1939.

This way nobody can accuse you of cowardice or treason, something certain parts of the german government excelled at.

I don't see anything heroic or praise worthy in it, I find it rather sad that a soldier has to take his own life to prevent his

family from being sent to... places.

 

But yeah, how noble of him to wait with his suicide until his crew was save, nevermind that his officers had to convince him to do so.

 

Luckily these days we stopped doing that, someone miraculously figured out that living to fight another day is better than shooting yourself in the head...


 

Edit:

Also, because I forgot this is the internet and people go nuts over things that aren't mentioned but are part of basic logic:

 

I have respect towards each and any fellow soldier of the past, present and future.

It takes guts to pick up a weapon, well knowing you'll be using it to hurt or kill other people and all that because

humanity failed once again to come together instead of sharpening sword and spear.

 

I respect the sailors of the german navy, past, present and future, for their willingness to fight for their nation, family and people.

However this doesn't change facts, and it's a fact that the german admirality of ww2 was outdated in it's ideaology and strategies and that

the navy itself was underfunded and lacking ressources.

 

And it also doesn't change the fact that suicide to protect your social standing and thus your family's status and well being isn't heroic.

It's one of the worst ideaologies deployed by some of the most terrible governments and military forces to have ever graced this Earth.

Even leaving all emotional and moral baggage aside it's a missuse of human ressources and showcase of bad leadership.

 

After fierce fighting in the normandy and with allied forces pressing towards Paris the german government gave orders to the general in charge of Paris

to destroy the entire city.

Not to destroy roads, railways and bridges leading to Germany to stop or delay the allied advance, but to destroy landmarks, houses, and all of Paris itself.

 

The general refused, despite what it could mean for his family even in the ending phases of the war, he refused and turned control of the city over to the french.

It saved the lives of many of his soldiers, many french freedom fighters, citizens and allied soldiers.

And it saved one of Europe's grandest cities.

 

That's the kind of government soldiers like Langsdorff had to serve under.

One that would destroy anything that it couldn't have and had it's military officers suicide to protect their families.

Hence, once more, there was no honour, no heroism or patriotism in Langsdorff's suicide, only another sad and

idiotic sacrifice to a government that didn't deserve even a quarter of what the german people sacrificed for it.

 

Edit²:

And because I'm in the mood for it.

A decision I believe you don't even have the balls to make.

 

 rxrNSZY.jpg

tsMDlg1.jpg

 

In Treue fest.

 

Edited by Retia

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Would've sunk if the engagement continue? The 2 British cruiser withdraw because they're heavily damaged. If they continue, they(the British) would've sunk. 

 

Graf spee actually sinks 50000 tons of shipment, 5 times more than its displacement. Fulfilling her duty as a sea pirate. And most importantly, she draws attention of the British and make them send more ships to south atlantic, away from their home waters. Exactly what the German wants.

 

Langsdorff is responsible for his ship, he scuttle her because he doesn't have anytime to repair her, and also because of the rumor about The British planning a big ambush. His officer didn't convinced him to suicide, they begged him to leave when he scuttle his ship. But at the end he choose to follow his ship. He is responsible for his ship's death and he's willing to pay for it. He believed that for a captain with a sense of honor, it goes without saying that his personal fate cannot be separated from that of his ship. 

Of course he died honorably.

His funeral was attended by many, even some British come to pay their respect. Who are you to criticize him? 

 

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Who are you to criticize him? 

 

You may want to re-read my post, I know it's a lot of letters, words and sentences, but feel free to take your time.

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And if you're actually was/a German soldiers at Afghanistan than you know the life of a soldier. You should have respected Langsdorff, instead of blindly claiming his death was idiotic.

 

Edit: Also you dont look like a seamen, Langsdorff believe that a captain should go down with his ship. Its a general tradition for all seamen. A captain is responsible for his ship, and everyone else on board. He must try to save them, or die trying. His death has nothing to do with the nazi government.

Edited by Admiral_Turing

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And if you're actually was/a German soldiers at Afghanistan than you know the life of a soldier. You should have respected Langsdorff, instead of blindly claiming his death was idiotic.

 

Edit: Also you dont look like a seamen, Langsdorff believe that a captain should go down with his ship. Its a general tradition for all seamen. A captain is responsible for his ship, and everyone else on board. He must try to save them, or die trying. His death has nothing to do with the nazi government.

 

 

You may want to re-read my post, I know it's a lot of letters, words and sentences, but feel free to take your time.

 

No, really, take your time to read.

Edited by Retia

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I only want to say this

 

A captain that wants to follow his ship's fate is not idiotic. It's an honorable act, Langsdorff didn't flee from his responsibilities to protect his ship and his crew. His suicide has nothing to do with the so called bad government, not to protect his families etc. but to keep his honor as a captain.

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What People like about Graf spee, is the romance that surround Her Journey

Not her particular "Meh" combat record, Her sister Admiral Scheer have way better combat record. if talking stellar Raider - the U-boat do that task way way way better

 

The romance of a lone raider on the high seas in wartime can be fascinating for some people. 1 Ship alone, Independently raiding Coastal cities, Hijack merchant ships, its a truly great adventure

that cant be help being popularized by well known SMS Emden colorfull Voyage, decades Earlier

In a sense, Surface raider is modern Pirates, and Pirate story have some way to mystizce people. Like how modern Captain jack sparow advanture did

 

The journey of Graf spee , were a Journey full of Drama. Did that a Cowardly decision, or a touching humanity from her Captain,

Seasoned with all with web of British deceit that forced the German Captain’s hand.

 

To add the Twist of Romance, Surrounding her Journey

Her Namesake, the Person she was Named of

Admiral Graf Maximilian Von Spee, were baited by a fake order to raid the British coaling station at Port Stanley in the Falklands. 

British deception pushed the German warships into a one-sided battle that led to their destruction 25 Years Earlier.

 

And That Happen less than a thousand miles away.

It very interesting Tale spanning 25 years, that cant help make you put a wry smile on your face.

 

Edited by humusz

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I only want to say this

 

A captain that wants to follow his ship's fate is not idiotic. It's an honorable act, Langsdorff didn't flee from his responsibilities to protect his ship and his crew.

 

I feel like your sense of honor and what it really means is a bit warped.

The true meaning of a captain going down with his ship is that he (or she by today's standarts) stays on board until the last crewman or passenger has left the sinking ship.

That is an honorable action although to a degree very unrealistic considering that during a ship's sinking there often are people cut off from any exits and without knowledge

of others, including the captain.

 

In the past this usually meant that the captain died, because ships tend to sink rather quickly after a while and the pull from the ship sinking into the deep water

took all sailors near it down, too.

Being the last to attempt an escape, the captains, along with other officers were usually sucked into the ocean together with their ships.

 

His suicide has nothing to do with the so called bad government, not to protect his families etc. but to keep his honor as a captain.

 

Langsdorff had lost one of Germany's few heavy cruisers in an necessary action to prevent further loss of life.

Like I wrote in the beginning, the Graf Spee took heavy damage against the technically inferior british cruisers

and thus was very unlikely to make it back to Germany or another axis controlled port with the means of repair.

 

The german government had mistakenly thought the navy would miraculously beat the allied combined navies with ease.

Early victories and the sunken tonnages from convoy raiding further expanded this belief.

However when the tides started to turn on them and the true weakness of the german navy was revealed the government quickly

became judgemental.

 

The same happened during the mid to late war years, where many german military leaders either suicided on their own to protect their families,

were pressured into suicide or suicided because they were one of those few true followers of the governments ideology.

 

Langsdorff's letter and testimonies of his officers and crew were the evidence he left behind to prevent any damage to his

career and social standing.

And if you ignore that families of officers like him were under direct threat from the goverment should they lose it's

favour then you're really just not understanding the true significance of what these soldiers had to go through.

 

Not to mention that his actions also protected his second family, his crew and fellow officers from scrutiny.

 

To me that's not an honourable action, it's a tragic and so very unnecessary sacrifice

to appease a self destructive regime's mood swings.

 

And as mentioned before, this has nothing to do with the respect I have towards any and all soldiers, men and women who take up arms

to fight for a flag, people or idea, be it friend or foe.

Langsdorff has my respect for his dedication as a soldier, not for suiciding out of necessity.

 


 

@humusz

 

Yeah, I can fully agree with that, people often look at romanticised version of reality and reach for these only,

leaving facts and truths behind completely.


I, too, enjoy these views of the world, human history and especially military engagements, however I feel like

striking, or better to write, attempting to strike a balance between romanticised and real version is a much better idea.


That is, at the end of the day, one of the main reasons I play videogames.

They strike a bridge between these two, although in games like WoWS it's very much left to one's own imagination.


Edited by Retia

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