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9mm1n

Correlation between ship travelling speed, shell flight time and leading of shots

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TL;DR:

Aim your reticle at the point where [TargetShipSpeed / 12] * ShellFlightTime measured in knots.

*shell travel time on your static reticle.

 

For easier calculation, here's a rule of thumb for the [TargetShipSpeed / 12] :

Cruiser has a Multiplier ranging from 2.7~3

Slow BBs have Multipliers below 2 and Fast BBs have Multipliers around 2.5

DDs have Multipliers ranging from 2.8~3 however, Soviets DDs are signaficantly faster with Kiev and Tashkent sitting at 3.5 and Khab at 3.6 without using the boast consumable.

 

 

For a simpler calculation, you can use Multiplier* ShellFlightTime

Screenshot (3081).png

A chart of Multipliers can be found on this Google spread sheet file https://drive.google.com/open?id=1mFVlYoxLc6r8qtoMmjIZuMYknY5luFUIoE3xvQc879k

 

The method (Equation) holds true at everyrange

ioRSAXI.jpg

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[explaination]

 

\\Review on iChase's method.

According to iChasegaming(iChase)'s video, World of Warships - Captain's Academy #25 - How to Aim and Lead Effectively with the Reticule, a method already exists to lead one's shoots with consideration of the speed of ship they’re shooting.

 

Said method proposed that the ingame static reticle is calibrated to battleships travelling at 20 knots, and that if one leads his gun's marker in corresponding to his shell travel time, the shell will land accurately into the center of the hull. Conversely, according to the method, aiming at Cruisers that typically travel at 30 knots would imply that the player has to point his gun's markers at

(30 knots/ 20 knots) (ShellFlightTime)

=1.5 * ShellFlightTime

 

and for Destroyers, which typically travels at the 35-43 knot,

(40 knots/ 20 knots) (ShellFlightTime)

=2 * ShellFlightTime

However, at 5:05 of the video, iChase mentioned that "the rules doesn't apply perfectly on destroyers". As the video clip goes, iChase fires at a Blyskawiska travelling at 39 knots with his reticle aimed according to the method above, but the shell failed to land at the optimal area of the Blyskawiska: the shells landed at its stern .

 

Upon closer examination of the above , we can observe there are imperfections to said aiming method. Although the method provides us with insight on how to hit targets, the method is spoiled by not taking the length and distance of targeted ship in the calculation. By neglecting the length (or thereby size) of a ship, the precision of such aiming method is compromised.

 

A possible solution to mend this flaw in the aiming process is to redefine the relationship between battle elements, namely the shell flight time and speed of ships, and to forgo the usage of any reference point, which reliablity is hampered by the design of ships and.

 

\\Conjecture

Theoretically speaking, the relationship between Shell Travelling Time and the Speed of Target Ship can be expressed with a linear equation y = ax+b, where a is a constant, b being a placeholder, x is a variable representing Shell Travelling Time and y represents the value of the marker to be aimed at.

 

A possible notation to the relationship between Ship Speed, Shell Flight Time and can the value of reticle markers can be

Value Reticle Marker = (Multiplier) * ShellFlightTime

 

The problem is now narrowed down to the Multiplier

 

In iChase's demonstration at 4:11 in the video, he shoots at a Tirpitz at 12 km  The shell travelling time of the shells is 6.88 seconds and the shells landed on Tirpitz, which, when the guns were being fired, was at -17.5 mark the reticle.

 

By comparing the Shell Travelling Time and the Speed of the, we can see that (17.5/6.88s)~= 2.54. Such indicates that multiplying 2.54 to the shell travelling time should return us the value where we should point our reticle at; dividing the speed of the Tirpitz (30.5 knots) to 2.54, we obtain the relationship between the speed of ship and the multiplier, which roughly equals to 12.

 

Therefore, we devise

(TargetShipSpeed / 12 ) * ShellFlightTime

as the closest possible way to aim at a particular point of a ship.

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What we've here is a evolution to iChase's aiming method. Instead of using the bow as a reference point, which reliability would be affected by the length and the design of the ship, we directly point the reticle markers at the point where we wish the shell would land.

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\\Demontration

For example, in shooting a Tirpitz travelling at 30 knots, we have a multiplier of

(30.5/12) 2.5

Hence the ReticleValue we need for shooting accurately at the Tirpitz in question would be 2.5. Where 2.5* ShellFlightTime should be where the shells shall land(unless, of course RNGesus hates you).

 

ioRSAXI.jpg

 

The problem is, some of the multipliers are rather difficult to process. And that calculating the multipliers on the fly is difficult enough. Which brings us to a spreadsheet I've compiled as a shortcut to the problem( https://drive.google.com/open?id=1mFVlYoxLc6r8qtoMmjIZuMYknY5luFUIoE3xvQc879k  - the spreadsheet is incomplete for now because it's complied awhile ago but will be updated very soon).

jkJybt3.png

 

Column F of the spreadsheet denotes the multiplier to be multiplied to the Shell Travelling Time. Assuming the targeted ship moves at her top speed(ignoring flag or consumable bonuses), simply multiply the value on Column F to the Shell Flight Time are you're set.

 

For easier calculation, here's a rule of thumb:

Cruiser has a Multiplier ranging from 2.7~3

Slow BBs have Multipliers below 2 and Fast BBs have Multipliers around 2.5

DDs have Multipliers ranging from 2.8~3 however, Soviets DDs are signaficantly faster with Kiev and Tashkent sitting at 3.5 and Khab at 3.6 without using the boast consumable.

 

iChase, World of Warships - Captain's Academy #25 - How to Aim and Lead Effectively with the Reticule

KAsual, Chart of  Multipliers https://docs.google....879k/edit#gid=0

[/explaination]

 

I would like to thanks iChase for letting me use screenshots in his video to illustrate my point

Screenshot (3081).png

Explaination.jpg

Edited by 9mm1n

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I found that video to be somewhat helpful. As mentioned by him and you, it isn't perfect and taking into account how difficult it is (for me anyway) to accurately guess how fast they are going without spending a couple seconds in binoc view, I usually use it just to make general assumptions, and refine my shots from the first one if necessary. 

I find the hard part of aiming to be when they are taking some sort of diagonal path at medium/long ranges, rather than a basically linear vertical or horizontal path. I find it is better for me to estimate a spot based on shell flight and guessed travel speed, since I have only missed shots if I try line up any part of the markers with the ship

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Thanks for the math and explaination , but seriously you wont do math when firing at stuffs. Ship speed is not known in a battle therefore the calculation is not useful unless you approximate . Also the floaty flight path of US , some cruisers and RN CL will need more leading and more vertical aim guess. I mean we not only need to hit a target , we also need to aim so that the shot has a chance to inflict module or heavy damage. But anyway , nothing cure your aiming better than RNGJESUS :teethhappy: , here or there a ship will die to just 1 shot due to the "fair" ammo rack blow up

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then there's also the relative displacement/spread of shells in a single salvo. in the end the best we could do is plot down the general area as to where we should lead our shots.

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then there's also the relative displacement/spread of shells in a single salvo. in the end the best we could do is plot down the general area as to where we should lead our shots.

 

True, the very purpose of this proposed aiming method is to ensure that WE as the player can have better understanding on aiming and thereby increasing the chance of hitting the intended area of enemy ships

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When come into aiming, extra from ship relative speed ships class may take into account as well

my aim method usually use enemy smoke tail as a indicator. Assuming ship constantly travel in straight line, I used dynamic aim as a primary reticle.

BB/CV = shell travel time * 0.5

CA/CL = shell travel time * 1.0

DD = shell travel time * 2.0+

with this it help me hit the target far more easier. The rest depend on RNGsus.

 

It difficult to practice perfect aim especially ship turn in and out from reticle line though.  

Edited by New_Horizontal

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When come into aiming, extra from ship relative speed ships class may take into account as well

my aim method usually use enemy smoke tail as a indicator. Assuming ship constantly travel in straight line, I used dynamic aim as a primary reticle.

BB/CV = shell travel time * 0.5

CA/CL = shell travel time * 1.0

DD = shell travel time * 2.0+

with this it help me hit the target far more easier. The rest depend on RNGsus.

 

It difficult to practice perfect aim especially ship turn in and out from reticle line though.  

 

The point of this method is you'll be able to hit “a precise point of a ship” instead of “the ship in general”. And that the only parameters that matter are the speed of your target and which part of it do you want to hit; the nation or class that your targeted ship doesn't matter

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The point of this method is you'll be able to hit “a precise point of a ship” instead of “the ship in general”. And that the only parameters that matter are the speed of your target and which part of it do you want to hit; the nation or class that your targeted ship doesn't matter

 

​I never said nation involve in aiming

and I said from my experience, conditions and parameter also count in what I said already which ship class matter into aim especially sniping

and to be able to hit a certain part when sniping you need RNG to do that too

 

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Beta Tester
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This is nice and all, but all these number crunch are useless when you're in the hit of battle and in need of a quick shot while thinking of 10 other things. Overthinking will lead you to tunnel vision. At the end, the reticle's use for me is to estimate the straightness of my target's heading relative to me, those tiny vertical lines are near useless. If you play DOTA 2 for example, sniping should be the same way to you as last hitting creeps; it should all be done by your instinct.

 

My method will be to look at how far back the target's ship smoke is relative to the smoke stack, I can then estimate if it's 1/4 2/4 3/4 full. Then your knowledge about the target's ship max speed (don't generalize them by class), then your gun's flight time, then fire once to calibrate your brain. Adjust accordingly.

Edited by Deicide

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Super Tester
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Look it's math!

 

Jokes aside, this is a very nice post for players who are trying to understand how the aiming works. For me I look at funnel smoke and gauge the speed, then aim either 5, 10, 15, or off the scale depending on enemy speed and shell speed. Make sure you know thy enemy so you can do big damage everytime hehe

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ugh... is this a thesis paper or something. Sorry I could not go thru it, Im sure some will find this useful.

 

I just shoot where my brain tells me to shoot... adjusted with a bit of trial and error.

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ugh... is this a thesis paper or something. Sorry I could not go thru it, Im sure some will find this useful.

 

I just shoot where my brain tells me to shoot... adjusted with a bit of trial and error.

 

it's a semi-serious post taking the form of a corrupted thesis paper.:teethhappy:

To be quite honest the only lines that matters in the OP are the first 3 lines; the rest are just explaination to it and I just chose a very lose form of a paper for that purpose 

Edited by 9mm1n

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umn isn't it easier to fire 1 gun, watch, adjust, fire the rest?

 

The point of the this theory is to eliminate the trial and error process of "Fire, Adjust, Fire the Rest".

You see in trial firing at your enemy, you risk alarming your enemy ship and subsequently. Eliminating the process means that you now have a higher chance of striking you enemy at first strike. 

 

Not only that, the theory also enable you to accurately point at your enemy. Coupled with the fact that you now has a higher first strike capacity, given your enemy hasn't notice you're shooting them, should equate to a better chance of dealing large amount of damage in the first blow of your guns.

 

 

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The point of the this theory is to eliminate the trial and error process of "Fire, Adjust, Fire the Rest".

You see in trial firing at your enemy, you risk alarming your enemy ship and subsequently. Eliminating the process means that you now have a higher chance of striking you enemy at first strike. 

 

Not only that, the theory also enable you to accurately point at your enemy. Coupled with the fact that you now has a higher first strike capacity, given your enemy hasn't notice you're shooting them, should equate to a better chance of dealing large amount of damage in the first blow of your guns.

 

 

 

after a period of time you drop the test firing as you learn how your ship performs.

The maths is all well and good, but experience trumps every time.

A WW2 fact is that a fully worked up team could beat the "computer of the time" in working out the correct angles to hit the target.

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after a period of time you drop the test firing as you learn how your ship performs.

The maths is all well and good, but experience trumps every time.

A WW2 fact is that a fully worked up team could beat the "computer of the time" in working out the correct angles to hit the target.

 

Well I'm simply trying to share my idea on aiming and attempts to provide a shortcut and a deeper understanding to the matter
Edited by 9mm1n

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The spreadsheet has now been updated with RN cruisers and 

 

Also:

For easier multiplication, here's a rule of thumb 

Cruisers has a Multiplier ranging from 2.7~3

Slow BBs have Multipliers below 2 and Fast BBs have Mulitpliers around 2.5

DDs have Multipliers ranging from 2.8~3. However, Soviet DDs are signaficantly faster with Kiev & Tashkent at 3.5 and Khab at 3.6

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You shouldnt need this kind of help to hit a target moving in a straight line - based on your experience you should be able to do it if you can see the heading of the ship and she'll flight time, at ANY distance.

 

If you can't, you are potato and you should go back to where you came from (tier 1).

 

The challenge comes when the ship is turning, or when turning erratically. Humour me, make a formula for that.

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You shouldnt need this kind of help to hit a target moving in a straight line - based on your experience you should be able to do it if you can see the heading of the ship and she'll flight time, at ANY distance.

 

If you can't, you are potato and you should go back to where you came from (tier 1).

 

The challenge comes when the ship is turning, or when turning erratically. Humour me, make a formula for that.>>

 

>You shouldnt need this kind of help to hit a target moving in a straight line

True

 

>based on your experience you should be able to do it if you can see the heading of the ship and she'll flight time, at ANY distance.

But by how much? Although you can gain experience on how to aim overtime, the idea behind this post is that we're able to mathematically quantify the relationship and develop better understanding, which enable us with better aiming techniques

 

>The challenge when the ship is turning. 

I consider a better understanding of how the reticle relates to shell travelling time would allow better performance in situations such as when your enemy is turning or travelling in a diagonal course

 

 

 

btw added a picture from iChase's video. Screencaps used with permission

Edited by 9mm1n

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Super Tester
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Wait what, you mean looking at the shell flight timer and imagining where enemy citadel would be after x seconds stated in the timer is not the way to aim????

 

Oh god I really need to go back to tier I and learn trigonometry...

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Wait what, you mean looking at the shell flight timer and imagining where enemy citadel would be after x seconds stated in the timer is not the way to aim????

 

Oh god I really need to go back to tier I and learn trigonometry...

 

By no means do I imply there's a correct or right way to aim. I'm merely providing my take on interpretation of the reticle.

 

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Well I'm bad math and physics how to calculating 

Grade F you know 

 

at the end of the op I've included a general rule of thumb for multipliers 

Once you get to know the multipliers, it's just simple multiplication afterwards. 

 

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