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Fear_the_Reaper

Good to see the match maker is still broken

Faster ques or better quality battles?   

33 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you rather a 2 tier split with 5 second - 30 second que times on average?

    • Heck yeah! i want to get into the action as fast as possible.
    • No the split in tiers is the main thing that concerns me in this game, que times do not concern me.
    • I have not really thought about it.
  2. 2. Would you rather a 1 tier split with 1 minute - 2 minute que times on average?

    • Heck yeah! i want the quality of the battles to be priority over que times.
    • No, i like the challenge of fighting a ship 2 tiers above mine in battle, short ques are a bonus.
    • I have not really thought about it.

45 comments in this topic

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Beta Tester
771 posts
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Haha just lovely, 2/3 matches still have matchmaking like this when playing any tier other than 1 or 2 while 10,000 people are online:medal:

Rh2Mk38.jpg

That que took about 5 seconds like every other match i played today, Thank Ivan for fast matchmaking!

No doubt there were another 5 equally silly matches taking place in that tier range at the same time...

which begs the question...

Why is the 2 tier split still a thing?

 

I remember back in CBT the 2 tier split was because of the low population, whats the reason for it still being around?

It obviously doesn't work in this game like it does in world of tanks...

Please don't tell me the quality of matches is being more than halved simply so that people can have a 15 second que time when the loading screen alone is 45 seconds.....

This isn't exactly a fast paced game so whats the harm in minute long que times on average?

and thats assuming the ques would be 4-20 times as long with a 1 tier split btw.....

in reality they would probably be about the same as now, maybe 30 seconds long instead of 5-15...

 

Anywho, Lets go ahead and compare New Mexico VS N.Carolina's stats, is that fair?

No, Of course it's not...

But they fight each other 2/3 battles so it is a comparison that needs to be made :popcorn:

New Mexico

12 354mm cannons,

Reload time of 34 seconds,

Range of 17.3km (assuming arty plotting room mod)

Top speed of 21 knots

53200 hitpoints (assuming best hull)

N.Carolina

9 406mm cannons

Reload time of 30 seconds

Range of 27km (assuming arty plotting room mod)

Top speed of 27.5 knots

66000 hitpoints (assuming best hull) 

(I won't be mean and compare a stock New Mexico to a fully upgraded N.Carolina or their AA defense, i mean the game will be but i am nicer than that.)

 

I am sorry but there is no rationalization for those ships meeting each other in battle and that is only one end of a scale that it happens on.. Same goes for a Furutaka trying to do anything against a Myoko for an example or any other ship that is fighting one 2 tiers above itself...

 

It really is a shame...

This game works so well and is a blast to play when you do actually get that 1/3 matches with a 1 tier split..

But in the end playing for an hour to get 20 minutes of fun simply is not worth it, I would rather play 4 matches in world of tanks and have an hour of fun.

 

And that is the end of my rant for the night.

See you guys in a few months if i manage to check back on this game again, hopefully the match maker is fixed by then :honoring:

 

 

Edited by Fear_the_Reaper

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Beta Tester
605 posts
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The teams looks pretty well balanced to me.

 

Just because you personally are at a disadvantage does not mean your team is.  If you play well you will still have a positive influence on the outcome of the battle from bottom tier, and that assists in your team winning.

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Beta Tester
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well kinda works both ways for me atm

 

for DD and CLs/CAs AKA crusiers  it does feel a challenge and rewarding when sinking a higher tier opponent but sucks when your a BB  that just bounces higher tier bbs and get 1-2 shotted by them 

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Super Tester
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Looks balanced, only the minor thing about that line up is that your team has +1 DD & the enemy has +1 BB. And you being a tier 5 BB in a tier 7 match.

The MM rule is correct on that, tier 5 ship +/-2 tier difference.

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Beta Tester
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The teams looks pretty well balanced to me.

 

Just because you personally are at a disadvantage does not mean your team is.  If you play well you will still have a positive influence on the outcome of the battle from bottom tier, and that assists in your team winning.

 

Lol if you want to call the tier split balanced that is your decision but im not jumping on the band wagon.

It is nothing but unfair and ruins the game, this is just my personal experience playing, i say this because i have at least twice as much fun playing the game in a normal 1 tier split match.

 

If you can sit there and say it is fun or balanced to fight a Baltimore in a Pensacola then you simply have not played the game very much.

 

So it is not really very complicated, i am just not going to keep playing this game and i explained why considering the game keeps asking me if the match making is broken.

 

anywho have fun arguing about it, as long as you guys get to play that 1 in 100 battles where you kill a noob in a big scury ship and it makes you feel like a real good player right?

just forget about the other games where you are kept out of range by a player in a ship thats faster than yours and can fire further than yours, soooooo fun and fair and balanced guys, You are just a bad player if it is just you and a Nagato left while you are in your Omaha and you can't kill him.

Don't forget about that all important 15 second que time everyone can get to the 45 second loading screen faster :D

Edited by Fear_the_Reaper

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Super Tester
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anywho have fun arguing about it, as long as you guys get to play that 1 in 100 battles where you kill a noob in a big scury ship and it makes you feel like a real good player.

 

 

I didn't feel so pro when I killed Kiev attempt to torp my Fusou at 5km. He got detonated when I shot him with HE salvo. Just to say.

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Beta Tester
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I didn't feel so pro when I killed Kiev attempt to torp my Fusou at 5km. He got detonated when I shot him with HE salvo. Just to say.

 

So you had this 1 battle out of the thousands you have played where someone did something dumb?

you don't say?

 

Go through your replays and actually look at what happens in the matches, quite obvious that you have yet to do that and are getting starry eyed by the odd battle where something silly happens.

i used to do it on world of tanks when i had a win rating of 46%, i would say "no im a good player because of that battle where i killed 6 tanks"

in this game its just high tiered ships racing to knock out low tier ships, the team that does that first wins.

 

Then there are the 1 in 3 games where everything works normally and the matches are all really well fought... gee weird i wonder why.

must just be bad players on the teams where the tier split is 2....

seriously i am over that attitude, the average player in this game seems to be fairly competent, the incompetence seems to be a minority, at least here on the asia server that is...

 

i know im ranting and sorry for that, but gotta get it through to people somehow, if super testers think its fine while everyone else hates it there is something wrong.

Edited by Fear_the_Reaper

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Super Tester
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i can only say : Balanced

 

after 0.5.8 i could say that MM divide team very balanced into the point almost identically mirrored


i am amazed how ppl will always complaining about

 

example of MM complain history :

  • ppl used to complain about the unmirrored number of CV (ex : team A got 2 cv, team B got 1 CV). fixed
  • mm will always put same number of cv at different team . ppl complained about different tier of cv at other team (ex : team A got tier 7 and 5, and team B got 2 tier 6). fixed
  • mm will always put same number and tier of cv . cv mm become long, ppl ditched cv, then, ppl complain of lacking of cv makes dd rules. :fishpalm:
  • mm used to put +/- 3 tier ( i remember the time i have to face iowa's in my fuso :/). ppl complained about it . fixed
  • mm used to put different number of team but almost identical total tier. ppl also complained about it. fixed
  • now cv is almost non existence, or always same number/tier at different team. ppl start to complain about the number spread of other type of ship.
  • then ppl complain about the flooding of dd's number at other team since its not limited. fixed.
  • the number of dd limited into +/- 2 (ex : 3 vs 5. 2 vs 4). ppl also complained again. fixed
  • now the number of dd limited into +/- 1 (ex : 2 vs 3. 4 vs 5). the number of top tier ship also mirrored. the tier differences from 1 team to another also not big. now this guy complained about +/- 2 tier spread . :fishpalm:

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Beta Tester
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i can only say : Balanced

 

after 0.5.8 i could say that MM divide team very balanced into the point almost identically mirrored


i am amazed how ppl will always complaining about

 

example of MM complain history :

  • ppl used to complain about the unmirrored number of CV (ex : team A got 2 cv, team B got 1 CV). fixed
  • mm will always put same number of cv at different team . ppl complained about different tier of cv at other team (ex : team A got tier 7 and 5, and team B got 2 tier 6). fixed
  • mm will always put same number and tier of cv . cv mm become long, ppl ditched cv, then, ppl complain of lacking of cv makes dd rules. :fishpalm:
  • mm used to put +/- 3 tier ( i remember the time i have to face iowa's in my fuso :/). ppl complained about it . fixed
  • mm used to put different number of team but almost identical total tier. ppl also complained about it. fixed
  • now cv is almost non existence, or always same number/tier at different team. ppl start to complain about the number spread of other type of ship.
  • then ppl complain about the flooding of dd's number at other team since its not limited. fixed.
  • the number of dd limited into +/- 2 (ex : 3 vs 5. 2 vs 4). ppl also complained again. fixed
  • now the number of dd limited into +/- 1 (ex : 2 vs 3. 4 vs 5). the number of top tier ship also mirrored. the tier differences from 1 team to another also not big. now this guy complained about +/- 2 tier spread . :fishpalm:

All of those changes were good things.:medal:

If things can be better people will complain about them not being better and according to your record being silent about it is not a solution.

Edited by Fear_the_Reaper

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Beta Tester
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If you think this is painful, try being the only T6 CV in a T8 match.

 

This looks balanced.

 

that is my point, that is just one battle where i finally decided i needed to make a thread because i was starting to rant in game about it, they get a hell of a lot worse than the picture in the OP as i am sure you know, The battle in the OP wasnt really so bad for me because i was in the mighty Kongo so i still did a lot of damage:D

(would have beef different if i was in New York, i wouldnt have even reached the battle before my team died if i was in NY haha)

it goes for all ships, DD have a huge class divide when you compare them 2 tiers apart and they are expected to kill each other/survive while capping bases at the start of battle, many matches depend on the DD having an even fight because they cap the bases, if 3 high tier dd control 3 bases against 3 low tier dd it is good game well played by mm.

Edited by Fear_the_Reaper

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Video Contributor
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If things can be better people will complain about them.

 

Every person here says its balanced, so there's nothing wrong with +/- 2 MM.. It is to encourage bottom tier ships to fight against stronger ones because you get more exp from damaging higher tier ships.. There are ships that are terribly outclassed by their higher tier counterpart (even Fuso will be smacked hard by Nagato) but it doesn't mean it can't do anything..

 

You're on a New Mexico fighting against a NoCar? DON'T FIGHT IT.. Let your team T8 BBs deal with it while you focus on killing cruisers and lesser ships.. Knowing the ship you're facing can give you valuable info about its armor and where to pen it.. I've citadeled Iowas in my Fuso, it can be done..

 

OP wanted stricter tier spread while i'm here laughing at Iowas shooting my angled Tirpitz doing zero damage..

 

-----

The only issue that MM still haven't solved is unbalanced nationalities, which is perfectly shown on OP's screenshot.. And for me its a much bigger deal than MM spread

Edited by Eurobeat

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Beta Tester
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OP wanted stricter tier spread while i'm here laughing at Iowas shooting my angled Tirpitz doing zero damage..

 

You realise Tirpitz is a tier 8 and Iowa is a tier 9 right?

what happens when you are the last ship left in your Tirpitz and you are left fighting a Yamato?

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You realise Tirpitz is a tier 8 and Iowa is a tier 9 right?

what happens when you are the last ship left in your Tirpitz and you are left fighting a Yamato?

 

it means that our team isn't doing well

 

tirpitz vs yamato  this happens only when your team doesnt work together or are bad

can't go around blaming things like this

 

i personally fought 2 yamato on my tirpitz they dont event bother shooting at me after i pointed my bow at them

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Member
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Why is everyone complaining that bottom tier ships is outclassed? I find it better than being a bottom tier tank. A New Mexico can deal tier 8 match better than any tier 6 tank in a tier 8 match

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Why is everyone complaining that bottom tier ships is outclassed? I find it better than being a bottom tier tank. A New Mexico can deal tier 8 match better than any tier 6 tank in a tier 8 match

 

i m not complaining im actually enjoying shooting at higher tiers sometimes especially in DD or small cruisers 

reasons

higher exp

lower priority target

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Video Contributor
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You realise Tirpitz is a tier 8 and Iowa is a tier 9 right?

what happens when you are the last ship left in your Tirpitz and you are left fighting a Yamato?

 

Torp and ram the Yamato. I get a lot of experience and credits for killing him while he gets nothing from killing a 'worthless' T8 :trollface:

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i m not complaining im actually enjoying shooting at higher tiers sometimes especially in DD or small cruisers 

reasons

higher exp

lower priority target

 

Two thread inside a week complaining about MM and asking stricter MM spread? I call that complaining. There are a lot of supporter in other thread

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Torp and ram the Yamato. I get a lot of experience and credits for killing him while he gets nothing from killing a 'worthless' T8 :trollface:

 

well said :o plus his repair cost 

ROFL LEL *hue spam*:izmena: RAMMING SPEED

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Beta Tester
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Lol if you want to call the tier split balanced that is your decision but im not jumping on the band wagon.

It is nothing but unfair and ruins the game, this is just my personal experience playing, i say this because i have at least twice as much fun playing the game in a normal 1 tier split match.

 

What I'm saying is that the teams are well balanced against each other.  This is a team game, not an individual game.  You might be in a relatively weak ship for the battle, but that doesn't mean the teams are not balanced.

 

If you can sit there and say it is fun or balanced to fight a Baltimore in a Pensacola then you simply have not played the game very much.

 

Calling me a noob is probably not the best route to go down for your argument.  I counter your point with - why are you fighting against a tier 9 ship while you are in a tier 7 ship?  That seems like a poor tactical decision to me.  Go find the enemy ships that your ship is strong against, like DD's and enemy cruisers of the same tier and fight against them.  Perhaps stay near some friends to reduce the chances you'll be focused.  Avoid parts of the map where there are lots of high tier enemy ships.  In other words, adapt your tactics to the situation.  If you can't do this when you're bottom tier, you won't be particularly successful in this game.  See it as a challenge, and adapt to it.  Remember, the teams are balanced, so you just have to do better than the low tier ships on the other team to do your bit, you aren't there to 1v1 their top tier ships.

 

You are just a bad player if it is just you and a Nagato left while you are in your Omaha and you can't kill him.

 

If you get in the situation where the only ships alive are you in an Omaha and an enemy Nagato, then your team has been outplayed.  You shouldn't expect that every 1v1 situation in the game will be balanced, that is absurd and unrealistic.  Do the best you can with the situation you are presented with.

Edited by Moggytwo

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Sigh...

 

http://forum.worldofwarships.asia/index.php?/topic/16629-matchmaker-a-novel-idea/

 

Well, I'm one of those players who like the challenge of being the bottom tier. A perfectly equal tier MM would be boring, imho.

 

Besides, tier gap isn't that much of an issue in this game. Tier 6 ships is capable of defeating a tier 8, and a tier 8 can also beat tier 10, as long as you know how to outplay your opponent. The main issue of the MM was the disparity in number of each class (ex 3 DD vs 6 DD) but it has been mostly fixed in the latest patch.

 

You seem to forget that this is a tactical, team vs team game. Not a 1 vs 1 game. If WoWs was a 1 vs 1 game, ofc I would agree with you. But the point of this game is how to work together with your teammates, doing your roles, what you're supposed to do in a ship that you sailed with. You need to consider what your ship can and cannot do while playing, not blindly shooting at every enemy you see.

 

If you picked a bad fight like fighting Nagato in an Omaha like you mentioned, then it's your fault to begin with, not the MM.

 

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Beta Tester
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Ehh seems obvious that the small but vocal and impatient minority gets to make the rules when it comes to this topic and there is not even room for a discussion about it.

Seen as thats the case ill give my honest opinion,

Honestly i think people that want 15 second que times in a game that takes 5 minutes to fire a salvo should find a different game to play but ah well it is me that needs to find a different game and i can live with that.

Has been like this since CBT so can't really expect it to change...

Anywho...

 

What I'm saying is that the teams are well balanced against each other.  This is a team game, not an individual game.  You might be in a relatively weak ship for the battle, but that doesn't mean the teams are not balanced.

 

Calling me a noob is probably not the best route to go down for your argument.  I counter your point with - why are you fighting against a tier 9 ship while you are in a tier 7 ship?  That seems like a poor tactical decision to me.  Go find the enemy ships that your ship is strong against, like DD's and enemy cruisers of the same tier and fight against them.  Perhaps stay near some friends to reduce the chances you'll be focused.  Avoid parts of the map where there are lots of high tier enemy ships.  In other words, adapt your tactics to the situation.  If you can't do this when you're bottom tier, you won't be particularly successful in this game.  See it as a challenge, and adapt to it.  Remember, the teams are balanced, so you just have to do better than the low tier ships on the other team to do your bit, you aren't there to 1v1 their top tier ships.

 

If you get in the situation where the only ships alive are you in an Omaha and an enemy Nagato, then your team has been outplayed.  You shouldn't expect that every 1v1 situation in the game will be balanced, that is absurd and unrealistic.  Do the best you can with the situation you are presented with.

The teams are not well balanced though, the fact that 9/10 battles with a 2 tier split are face rolls where one team had next to no chance of ever winning is a good indicator of that. maybe you just aren't noticing it because more often than not you are getting placed in the winning team, i know i do which is why i failed to notice it before watching 30 replays in a row where i paid attention to more than just my own performance.

 

But ah well, i am not going to try and talk reason with you, no one seem to want to discuss the topic with an open mind so lets leave it at your opinion is it is fine, mine is that it is broken.

neither of us will change our opinion on the topic and no amount of noob calling will make either of us feel better about our opinions in the end.

(I mean i am willing to actually discuss this seriously if others want to, be good if we could get a bunch of people to gather 10 or so replays of matches with a 2 tier split and another 10 with a 1 tier split from their folders and post them up to compare the battle results to see if there is actually a difference for the teams for an example)

 

I am honestly surprised no one has said the old "why don't you just play tier 1, 2, 9 or 10" yet, they do get fair match making lol.

Edited by Fear_the_Reaper

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Beta Tester
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Honestly i think people that want 15 second que times in a game that takes 5 minutes to fire a salvo should find a different game to play but ah well it is me that needs to find a different game and i can live with that.

 

I couldn't care less about the queue times, so long as they are less than 2 mins I'd be pretty happy.  I just don't want the game made easier (which is what you're asking for) because I enjoy the challenge of winning from difficult situations.

 

The teams are not well balanced though, the fact that 9/10 battles with a 2 tier split are face rolls where one team had next to no chance of ever winning is a good indicator of that. maybe you just aren't noticing it because more often than not you are getting placed in the winning team, i know i do which is why i failed to notice it before watching 30 replays in a row where i paid attention to more than just my own performance.

 

A two tier split does not make the teams unbalanced.  You could have the exact same ship composition on each team with a two tier split and the teams would be perfectly balanced.  The tier difference only becomes a balancing issue when one team has lots of high tier ships and the other lots of low tier ships. The latest match maker changes have completely removed this possibility.

 

Basically every game has a two tier split.  To say that 90% of those are face rolls to one team because of the split is absurd.  Once again you seem to think that having three different tiers in a game makes the game unbalanced.  It doesn't.  It merely makes it harder for the individual players in the low tier ships to do well.  There are equal numbers of those players on each team though, hence it is balanced.

 

Also, no one gets 'placed on the winning team'. You get placed on a team, and if that team plays better than the other team, you win.  If you as an individual play better than most of the other players in most of the battles you are in, then you end up on the winning team more often than the losing team.  It's pretty straight forward really.

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Super Tester
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A tier 7 in a tier 9 match is not much of a problem. Since shell calibers do not increase till T10.

 

The only three mm changes I want to vote on are:

(1) CVs should only get +/- 1 tier mm (no I don't play CV but I feel for them)

(2) DDs should be a mix of gunboat and torpedo boats (no I don't play dd, but getting only torpedo boats make it hard to win)

(3) Allow only one tier difference in division. (not much of a match maker problem, mainly pro/dumb people thing)

 

Didn't find these options in the poll. So no vote.

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