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Geralt_of_Korea

SAIPAN the Balance breaker of 7tier

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Saipan records 56.31% win rate for recent 1week, 57.05% win rate for 2weeks, and 55.25% win rate for all periods. 

 

It is also first position of entire CVs, entire periods. CV's balance has been one of most hot topic, especially Hakuryu and midway, However, their WR was below 55% even when it was the highest period.

 

Main problem is this : It has too powerful squads, and it is too easy to win. 

 

Let;s know how to win when we play saipan. First, take off our planes. Two, fighters to fighters, bombers to enemy CV and forget about it. Third, repeat above sequence one more exactly same. 

 

Then, Success!

 

Saipan's fighters are too fast and too powerful that Hiryu or Ranger's can't keep dd scout point. This situation makes ally's battle front retreat, than ally's air defense sector became smaller and smaller.

 

Furthermore, Saipan user don't need to focus on it's attack sequence. When hiryu controls 4 squads, each needs at least 3~4 sequence (approaching, alt-control, retreating), saipan needs just one-click! 

 

Consequently, Hiryu deals just 2000 pts averagely. (If calculate more exactly-suppose just hiryu-saipan conflict cases- I assure to saipan deals much more than hiryu.) 

 

 

Hiryu and Ranger cannot fight against with Saipan. Especially when the shit has 5-skilled commander. This issue breaks 6~8tier cv ecosystem thoroughly.

 

 

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Beta Tester
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It depends on the player who has that ship, and whether the Saipain uses 15-point CV captain or not. Indeed if the Saipan has that 5th row skill then I think it's the best CV at tier7 mainly due to her plane's speed.

 

Then again, recently WG changed their way of balancing, premium ships won't be nerfed (unless it's global, like what AA rebalance did to Yubari), so don't expect things to change any time soon. Unless WG buff other tier7 CV, Saipan gonna stay at the top for a while to come.

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I'm part of the "Nerf/Remove Saipan" club, but as much I rage about it I know they won't notice it until 1-2 years later. (KV1S, anyone?)

Before I state my reasons, let me be clear: I do not hate players who sail Saipan, I hate the damn ship.

Assume that I/you play the Hiryu without the Air Supremacy.

1. Saipan w/o Air Supremacy Skill (+1 Fighter, +1 Dive Bomber) is bearable. It becomes an alter-ego of Ranger and basically an American version of Hiryu.

Even on straight up dogfights, there are instances where my Hiryu easily defeats a 3-plane squadron of tier 10 planes. Though that's mostly 2/5 of the time.

 

2. Saipan WITH Air Supremacy Skill. Oh my God. -.- All it needs is someone who knows how to strafe and manual torp/dive bomb, and voila. Instant anti-Hiryu and giving Ranger players a bad day. Don't get me wrong, Ranger players w/o AS skill still puts up a fight and helps deal damage to ships, but Hiryu is basically just shut down (unless it has the AS skill, that basically puts it on even ground with Saipan). Otherwise, your planes will just get chased down, strafed, and you'll be raging at how this ship even exists.

 

This ship breaks the status quo/current CV logic of "US Planes have good fighters, but slow to catch up to IJN planes." Even with reduced ammo for its fighters it doesn't matter because it can still chase any other squadron, be it Ranger or Hiryu, and strafe it down with ease.

 

Really, how has WG/Lesta not see this as a problem is beyond me. Still busy fixing other things or maybe preparing the German/British line, I suppose.

 

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It depends on the player who has that ship, and whether the Saipain uses 15-point CV captain or not. Indeed if the Saipan has that 5th row skill then I think it's the best CV at tier7 mainly due to her plane's speed.

 

Then again, recently WG changed their way of balancing, premium ships won't be nerfed (unless it's global, like what AA rebalance did to Yubari), so don't expect things to change any time soon. Unless WG buff other tier7 CV, Saipan gonna stay at the top for a while to come.

 

Who knows. If it's too good they might pull it out of the game and just give it as competition prizes and/or bonus codes, like the Type-59.

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Super Tester
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Who knows. If it's too good they might pull it out of the game and just give it as competition prizes and/or bonus codes, like the Type-59.

very unlikely, look at the Grem and Imperator Nikolai :hiding:

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very unlikely, look at the Grem and Imperator Nikolai :hiding:

 

i want gremyashchy so bad, i have no money when she was release, but now that i have it she was no longer available. :(

 

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Saipan is a pain in the ass. The number of CV player that is left isn't much already. The Saipan just poped out from no where and ruined mu Hiryu game plays. The fighters can only be killed by the alt ability as the fighter a too durable in normal attacks. I can hear the screams of my pilots in the radio when they see the Saipan fighters. However, the high tier fighters is the thing that make the Saipan special, so I guess WG won't nerf it. 

 

Also, please buffer other premium ship to a bit better than normal. BB can be 5% more accurate than research ships, CA has better rudder shift time, and DDs... whatever, premium ships won't be buffed anywhere, sometimes I feels like WG is giving me a free giant middle finger with the purchase, especially the Mikasa guns and Yubari engine and Sims torps and Ishizuchi everything and Atago citadel (this is the thing that I actually like). 

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atago is already a fine ship, she got great concealment for a tier 8 cruiser, fast turning turrets and repair ability at tier 8. but sims torpedo at tier 7 is a joke. its only useful for scare tactics.

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i can citadel her where ever I want. Too much lead, guns. Just enough, engine. Not enough, rear guns. 

I love it when I am in my Pensacola or New Orleans 

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If you're in a Hiryuu or Ranger against a Saipan, you have to go against usual conventions on beating the enemy carrier.

 

First off, in strafing, just bulldoze your way to strafe. Getting a good position for a good strafing run is gonna put you at a disadvantage due to difference in plane speed. You are better off in just head-on strafing the enemy Saipan's fighter squadrons as soon as you get the chance. Do remember that if you take off around 1 or 2 from his fighter squadron even with a less-than admirable strafe, it's a great deficit to the Saipan's 48 total number of planes. So assuming a Hiryuu with (2/2/2) and a Saipan with (2/2/0) face off both having 24 fighters total.

 

Secondly, what a Hiryuu and Ranger can do better than a Saipan is taking out single targets more effectively. A Saipan can dish out a consistent amount of damage more often, but it will need to be in more runs. A Hiryuu and Ranger can stack DoT Fire or Flooding damage which can take out an important target which a Saipan isn't suited doing(unless you're lucky with flooding chances, even then, you'd be wasting sortie time just waiting for DCP). You can also go Strike Ranger and forgo any fighters and just plain outdamage the enemy Saipan. At least that's how I go about it since I'm not confident in controlling fighters.

 

I just bought the Saipan quite recently and am biased to a point I'd rather use a Hiryuu or Ranger for a T7 CV since I don't have Air Supremacy skill yet.

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All other US aircraft carriers are not performing as well as their IJN counterpart. You want to NERF the only US CV that's better than its counterpart?

Give me a break. This game gives me headaches about how IJN CV are just magically better than US CVs. I give up

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All other US aircraft carriers are not performing as well as their IJN counterpart. You want to NERF the only US CV that's better than its counterpart?

Give me a break. This game gives me headaches about how IJN CV are just magically better than US CVs. I give up

 

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WG:

 

indecisive_gif_0_1451479168_zps7xmjnug4.

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Saipan records 56.31% win rate for recent 1week, 57.05% win rate for 2weeks, and 55.25% win rate for all periods. 

 

It is also first position of entire CVs, entire periods. CV's balance has been one of most hot topic, especially Hakuryu and midway, However, their WR was below 55% even when it was the highest period.

 

Main problem is this : It has too powerful squads, and it is too easy to win. 

 

Let;s know how to win when we play saipan. First, take off our planes. Two, fighters to fighters, bombers to enemy CV and forget about it. Third, repeat above sequence one more exactly same. 

 

Then, Success!

 

Saipan's fighters are too fast and too powerful that Hiryu or Ranger's can't keep dd scout point. This situation makes ally's battle front retreat, than ally's air defense sector became smaller and smaller.

 

Furthermore, Saipan user don't need to focus on it's attack sequence. When hiryu controls 4 squads, each needs at least 3~4 sequence (approaching, alt-control, retreating), saipan needs just one-click! 

 

Consequently, Hiryu deals just 2000 pts averagely. (If calculate more exactly-suppose just hiryu-saipan conflict cases- I assure to saipan deals much more than hiryu.) 

 

 

Hiryu and Ranger cannot fight against with Saipan. Especially when the shit has 5-skilled commander. This issue breaks 6~8tier cv ecosystem thoroughly.

 

 

Saipan Bomber (3/0/1)+ Ranger Bomber Builds (0/2/3) = Impending Doom

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This ship breaks the status quo/current CV logic of "US Planes have good fighters, but slow to catch up to IJN planes."

 

 

This is a funny one. CVs are already broken before saipan arrived courtesy of WG dev team.

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Saipan is only really a menace because of its premium status; this makes high tier USN CV captains instantly transferrable and basically gives it a free AS. In addition, AS makes the fighters gain 33% strength instead of 25% for IJN or 16.6% for USN.

 

I faced these before I had AS and it was tough,  but not impossible. At T7 you cannot expect AS skill to be too prevalent so this is where the Ranger and Hiryu struggle a bit with fighters. 222 Hiryu with AS can deal with 220 easily (301 Saipan is hard to get past), and 202 Ranger with AS can tango even with 301 Saipan but struggles to deal damage.

 

The key thing is, Saipan does not have very good damage potential, especially DoT. A good Hiryu/strike Ranger captain can outdamage it. Hiryu can use standard IJN tactics (treat saipan fighters like ranger fighters) while Ranger captains have to play it smart and strike where fighters are not present if possible.

 

Sniping it is not advisable because of its relatively small size and fast interceptions by fighters. Personally, I would try to outdamage it since it does not have a high direct damage potential. You will lose the air a lot but win battles in return if you can outdamage/outkill it.

Edited by stratmania

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Saipan is only really a menace because of its premium status; this makes high tier USN CV captains instantly transferrable and basically gives it a free AS. In addition, AS makes the fighters gain 33% strength instead of 25% for IJN or 16.6% for USN.

 

I faced these before I had AS and it was tough,  but not impossible. At T7 you cannot expect AS skill to be too prevalent so this is where the Ranger and Hiryu struggle a bit with fighters. 222 Hiryu with AS can deal with 220 easily (301 Saipan is hard to get past), and 202 Ranger with AS can tango even with 301 Saipan but struggles to deal damage.

 

The key thing is, Saipan does not have very good damage potential, especially DoT. A good Hiryu/strike Ranger captain can outdamage it. Hiryu can use standard IJN tactics (treat saipan fighters like ranger fighters) while Ranger captains have to play it smart and strike where fighters are not present if possible.

 

Sniping it is not advisable because of its relatively small size and fast interceptions by fighters. Personally, I would try to outdamage it since it does not have a high direct damage potential. You will lose the air a lot but win battles in return if you can outdamage/outkill it.

 

the thing is, a good player will make the ship he or she uses op, ultimately, its the players themselves that bring out the true potential of the ships, not the ships stats itself. 

 

Saipan's strength lays in its superior agility and mobility in terms of its aircraft, not power in numbers. A good saipan player will exploit the speed it has for its aircraft in order to outdamage its foreign/similar non premium counterpart or flee from engagements, since most of the aircraft at that tier are slower than saipan's aircraft, given that its tier 9. Yes, Hiryu has a better damage output only because it has more squads, thus able to provide almost anything the team needs. But Saipan is a combination of IJN and USN frankenstein, its got speed (IJN reference) and smaller squads (USN reference), as what others had already mentioned, its in-between IJN and USN CV playstyle, except that its premium (P2W concept if you like). 

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the thing is, a good player will make the ship he or she uses op, ultimately, its the players themselves that bring out the true potential of the ships, not the ships stats itself. 

 

Saipan's strength lays in its superior agility and mobility in terms of its aircraft, not power in numbers. A good saipan player will exploit the speed it has for its aircraft in order to outdamage its foreign/similar non premium counterpart or flee from engagements, since most of the aircraft at that tier are slower than saipan's aircraft, given that its tier 9. Yes, Hiryu has a better damage output only because it has more squads, thus able to provide almost anything the team needs. But Saipan is a combination of IJN and USN frankenstein, its got speed (IJN reference) and smaller squads (USN reference), as what others had already mentioned, its in-between IJN and USN CV playstyle, except that its premium (P2W concept if you like). 

 

Well of course. If the player is good, the ship will look super OP. I am just recommending ways to beat the Saipan. Sometimes, trying to win the air does not work and you have to simply outdamage him (harder to do with recent AA buffs but hey...). Its kind of the same concept when playing Hiryu against an AS Ranger, but this time you pray that your team packs DF.

 

Yes, I know Saipan has T9 planes that are hard to shoot down, but shooting down even one will dent its strike nicely. That said, I am glad to be no longer grinding T7 CVs. Those things ARE a pain to face and you really need to be at the top of your game to beat it properly. I sometimes do feel that it may be slightly P2W, though not nearly as much as some others.

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If you want to nerf the last US CV that's better than its counterpart shame on you. I really wonder why almost all IJN CA/CL, BB, CV are better than its counterpart. This game is becoming absurd. 

 

This is not a USN vs IJN matter for me, it is a matter of carrier vs carrier balance. I would rather have USN buffed than IJN nerfed. DB RNG is frustrating.

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[LBAS]
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if they keep Saipan in Tier VII so very easy to kill all CV player.

I quit already, every day every time, CV player disapear one by one since Saipan coming.

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if they keep Saipan in Tier VII so very easy to kill all CV player.

I quit already, every day every time, CV player disapear one by one since Saipan coming.

 

I DO admit that Saipan feels like a sealclubber ship because of its position at T7 and that you don't meet a lot of AS skill CV there.

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I DO admit that Saipan feels like a sealclubber ship because of its position at T7 and that you don't meet a lot of AS skill CV there.

 

yeah, not many CV player got level5 captain skill at T7.

But if this keep going and no one want to play CV any more.

CV play style is bored enough, and they put Saipan in, keep boring, keep losing, and quit, very easy to destroy CV class in future.

No one has fun in CV play style any more, that why in high tier ver few of CV player.

How could CV T7 and planes T7 can deal with T9 planes, even CA T7 AA can not shoot down T9 planes.

Its already cheat in official, CV T7 and plane T7 vs CV T7 and  planes T9, too clearly cheat.

 

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