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SZYZWY

USN CV grind (up to T7)

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Over the past couple of weeks I've been dabbling on USN CVs and have reached the Ranger recently. To summarize the grind, I'd say: "It wasn't as bad as I thought it would be.". Since I started CV play on the IJN line, and was given the impression that IJN CVs were superior in the type of playstyle I do, I thought my USN CV grind would be a painful one. It just so happens that my IJN CV experience helped me a lot and the general experience on the UI of CVs made it much much easier. :hmm:

 

I'll just summarize what I experienced and I hope it'd be of help to any aspiring USN CV captain.

 

On the Langley:

Trying to grasp the difference in plane control of the USN, it started off rough. In good games however, getting one kill every single plane sortie became a norm. I mean, that TB squadron just OWNS especially with the lack of AA at the tiers. On the fighters however, especially when facing Hosho, the best thing to do was strafe, even when head-on. The moment the fighters lock and go into a dogfight, most of the time, Langley fighters will lose even with numerical superiority. The DB squadron on the Langley still has an IJN spread and works best to time the DoT as T3-4-5 has lots of HE flying around and torps pretty much everywhere. The Langley's reserves rarely dwindled, only when the enemy CV(s) themselves hunt your planes in which, your FT should be able to take care of.

 

On the Bouge:

The SEA server has lots of 2/0/1 Bouge to make life of other CV(or loadouts) at this tier hell. To advance faster, taking the balanced 1/1/0 or strike 0/1/2 is recommended. I mean, who wants to stay in T5 where every other game you'll be facing an AS loadout Bouge :P. (Unless you farm clear sky flags). I took the strike loadout myself and was able to deal a lot of damage (T7-T8 CV tier damage). That stemmed from my confidence of playing cat and mouse with other CV Fighters due to IJN experience. The reserves are less desirable than the 1/1/0 though with less than a squadron's worth of reserves. Games where I got fully shot down were still present and I recommend getting the 1/1/0 as it gives a more consistent flow of damage and guarantees air superiority against anything that's not an AS Bouge. I'd say a 1/1/0 Bouge could make around 40-60k damage on games if all air sorties are consistently good.

 

On the Indy:

To anyone who says that the Ranger is the low point of USN CVs, I'd beg to differ. The Indy gets matched up too often with T8s and weirdly, the planes don't have the survivability to take it. Trying to drop using a TB squadron on a Myoko just results in a wipe even without DF AA. Having only one set of reserves for each squadron just adds to the pain. Lastly, facing against RJs with either 3/1/1 or 1/2/2 is hard enough. Standard Loadout of 1/1/1 gave me a steady stream of damage as long as the picked targets are worth it. Against 1/2/2 RJs, it becomes a matter of getting Air Superiority. Just a few strafes achieve that and the RJs bombing potential dwindles while yours are kept at a steady pace. The danger of a snipe attempt is there but the Indy can handle it due to how USN FTs are and the good maneuverability coupled with the ship itself being short enough not to take 3 torps consistently. Against, 3/1/1, it becomes a matter of how to conserve your bombers and making use of the ammo of the fighter squadron. Damage wise though, the Indy should outclass an AS RJ and should be able to pull through. To people who don't want to deal with all of that, taking the AS loadout of 2/0/1 to be more of a utility is advised even if it slows the grind. Getting a strike loadout of 0/1/2 is pretty suicidal.

 

On the Ranger:

I admit, I'm having fun with the Ranger. I swap around the balanced 1/1/1 and the strike 0/1/3 and it definitely kicks ***. The plane durability also steps up a notch that the only deterrent are those that are dedicated AA ships/captains. With the balanced setup, you'll have 3 SETS OF RESERVES for each squadron which is the epitome of consistency. The durability of USN Squadrons also add to that fact. Only problem with the balanced setup is the inability to do bursts of damage to multiple ships. A steady flow of damage is till expected. Against Hiryuus, assuming they use 2/2/2, your fighter SHOULD fare pretty well with the use of strafing. The strike setup however is a high risk high reward type of loadout. Undefended, if the enemy CV tries to snipe, then the only hope is the cooperation of an ally to provide AA support. The reward however is the multiple bomber squadrons which have really high damage potential. Those DBs are BBs worst fiery nightmare. I'm of a mind to say that the strike ranger works way better with a division. Playing cat and mouse with the strike ranger is also a fun activity in and of itself.

 

Planes

I'm mostly gonna talk about how the USN planes work better or worse with their IJN counterparts.

 

Fighters:

More often than not, the USN CVs will have less fighter squadrons. Not to worry though, as I've been previously parroting, STRAFE is the answer. IJN Fighters which strafe is not even close to how a USN Fighter strafes. Head-on, the USN Fighter Squadron CAN still eliminate the whole squadrons. The same fighter squadron can also take a strafe head-on with minimal casualties(around 2 planes) in which you can counter with a strafe of your own. The Ammo is also large enough to warrant 3+ strafe runs at T7. With the modules, sometimes it is better NOT to upgrade the Fighter planes so it will have more ammo. Add to the fact that the usual AS loadout CVs you will face in randoms will group their squadrons together. :trollface:

 

Torpedo Bombers:

The bulk of your damage will come from your TBs either direct or indirect even on Ranger with a Strike loadout. It guarantees a DCP when it hits a CA/BB in a good bombing which make the target ripe for a DB strike run. Unless a captain takes the Torp Accel skill, never target a DD with your torp bombers. A fully attentive DD WILL ALWAYS be able to dodge it. What makes the USN TB squadron good is that the tight spread still allows for good bombing runs even when panicked. In general too, the USN Bombers are more durable due to AA calculations based per squadron. Getting 5-6 torp hits on really good runs with the USN TBs is what every captain should aim for which would decimate any CA or cripple a BB.

 

Dive bombers:

Most would say that the IJN DB spread is better, I say it is situational. The USN DB spread may be really RNG heavy, but it has the potential to get 3-4 fires which an IJN DB will only get 1-2 fires on good drops. With this of course, a USN DB should rarely target a DD and only scout it. Even with 6-7 planes, getting a hit due to the spread is considered lucky and it will be wasteful if it misses. At least, when targetting BBs, you are almost always guaranteed a hit unless RNG likes to laugh at you. It also goes without saying that timing the DoT to stack is needed for effective dive bombing.

 

In General(USN and IJN):

With all that, I can say that USN CVs need a decisive captain at the helm. The planes are relatively slower than the IJN but pack the durability to still push through disadvantageous circumstances. The long reload/replacement times are also a problem in which being decisive with strike runs, fast in and fast out seem to be a better strategy in order to mitigate it. IJN CVs in contrast, need more patience in their strike runs to effectively deal damage mostly due to how the spreads are and plane durability. They can also re-align for strikes a lot better than the USN for that purpose. On planes vs planes engagements of IJN vs USN, the USN will be defensive most of the time, mostly due to plane speeds and squadron number. IJN will most likely hope for a lock on fight while the USN should go for a devastating strafe(the IJN can do strafe the same, only a lot harder if players are of the same skill level). An IJN CV will have a bigger sphere of influence on the map while the USN CV will lord over a certain area or flank. The flow of the battle will be determined if the IJN CV will be able to extend his influence enough to deter the USN CV or if the USN CV(and its allies) can push or win the flank fast/effectively enough to guarantee a win. It makes the USN CV a more supportive type of ship(even the strike loadouts) while the IJN's balanced squadrons can do a lot more things solo. At least, that's my take on it. :hiding:

 

 

I didn't discuss sniping a lot since I myself don't do it unless necessary.

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Super Tester
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Seems like the USN CV is less stressful compared to IJN CV's... Might consider going for it. But then, there's the captain requirement...... :trollface:

 

Maybe its just me, but i feel USN CV's are generally slightly easier to handle since you have less squadrons to control. Sadly, can't ruin a DD's day just by parking a squad on top of him..... :trollface:

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Thanks for the analysis.

I never could make no-fighter work. I try a few game with strike Bogue in Co-op. I do slightly more damage than stock but mostly run out of planes by the game end.

Things is, in all those 3-5 matches. It's the usual damage race against other players. Matches end in under 12 minutes. And I run out of planes.

Imagine when human players derp hardly and I have to carry. Won't happen lol. No plane left.

 

And when someone talk about Langley vs Hoshou planes. I like to post this

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/74755-langley-vs-hosho-fighters/

 

I'm not sure about more micro-manage in IJN. You have choice to group them up. FT together Tb together and so on.

You can drop 2 tb at once from one side (one click).

Ofc you did not maximize your potential. And you end up try to control 8 groups at once.

At the end I feel like micro manage make IJN superior. If you don't then they are closer in potential.

But you don't have choice to split in USN

 

Indie make me quite USN CV but Ranger make me drool. Like to try to strike against bot sometime. (especial when the other side like to strike as well.)

Agree with indie be the low points. Ranger AS can do decent damage with dots. Nothing compare to Hiryu ofc.

 

Edited by Hero_of_Zero

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I'm in the 'group 2 or more of the same kind' player. Chips away at my thought processes if I attempt to control all 6 Hiryu squadrons individually for purposes other than scouting for DDs.

 

Seems like I'd enjoy having less squadrons due to them being easier to manage.

 

Problem is, I want to finish glorious imperial nippon ships.

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-snip-

 

Micromanaging squads where the reason I thought I'd have a bad time with USN CVs in the first place just because IJN was superior at that. I'm the type to control each squad individually in my Hiryuu/Shoukaku. Just so happens, a different type of control is needed for the USN.

Seems like the USN CV is less stressful compared to IJN CV's... Might consider going for it. But then, there's the captain requirement...... :trollface:

 

How I wish I had a Saipan.

I'll just drop off and say that the T5 perk from the captain skills isn't that important for USN CVs anyway. In fact, the T4 skill which reduces service time is much more needed.

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I just got the Indy today :(

My DB and TB are always wiped out :( i cannot achieve more than 3 torp hits due to monstrous AAs :( maybe because my planes are low tier :( i guess its much more beneficial to use AS on Indy and let the high tier CV and BB do the damage :(

 

a complete change of play style from the bogue. Its like moving from t28 proto to the t30 ;(

Edited by shemrafael987

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On the Ranger:

I admit, I'm having fun with the Ranger. I swap around the balanced 1/1/1 and the strike 0/1/3 and it definitely kicks ***. The plane durability also steps up a notch that the only deterrent are those that are dedicated AA ships/captains. With the balanced setup, you'll have 3 SETS OF RESERVES for each squadron which is the epitome of consistency. The durability of USN Squadrons also add to that fact. Only problem with the balanced setup is the inability to do bursts of damage to multiple ships. A steady flow of damage is till expected. Against Hiryuus, assuming they use 2/2/2, your fighter SHOULD fare pretty well with the use of strafing. The strike setup however is a high risk high reward type of loadout. Undefended, if the enemy CV tries to snipe, then the only hope is the cooperation of an ally to provide AA support. The reward however is the multiple bomber squadrons which have really high damage potential. Those DBs are BBs worst fiery nightmare. I'm of a mind to say that the strike ranger works way better with a division. Playing cat and mouse with the strike ranger is also a fun activity in and of itself.

 

I must admit, at first I thought USN carrier will be all about having AS and less focus on doing damage. On my early day as a CV captain I was doing horrible. And thing start to change when I see people running 012 on Bogue against me running 201. I was able to stop around 30% of his strike. then I realize that this AS build won't work since I can't stop most strike from happening. then I start running 012 on Bogue and my number start to goes up. Now I'm at my Ranger and I love her a lot, she's definitely my keeper. I start off using 111 just like what I do on Indy doing around 50k damage a game. Then I try the 013 loadout and it's rock! I start doing 70-100k damage per game. without any resistance from DF AA or enemy's fighter one wave of your strike loadout should mean atleast 1 ship sunk. I'm really looking foward to the Lady Lex and the rest of the line.

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Thanks for the analysis.

I never could make no-fighter work. I try a few game with strike Bogue in Co-op. I do slightly more damage than stock but mostly run out of planes by the game end.

Things is, in all those 3-5 matches. It's the usual damage race against other players. Matches end in under 12 minutes. And I run out of planes.

Imagine when human players derp hardly and I have to carry. Won't happen lol. No plane left.

 

And when someone talk about Langley vs Hoshou planes. I like to post this

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/74755-langley-vs-hosho-fighters/

 

I'm not sure about more micro-manage in IJN. You have choice to group them up. FT together Tb together and so on.

You can drop 2 tb at once from one side (one click).

Ofc you did not maximize your potential. And you end up try to control 8 groups at once.

At the end I feel like micro manage make IJN superior. If you don't then they are closer in potential.

But you don't have choice to split in USN

 

Indie make me quite USN CV but Ranger make me drool. Like to try to strike against bot sometime. (especial when the other side like to strike as well.)

Agree with indie be the low points. Ranger AS can do decent damage with dots. Nothing compare to Hiryu ofc.

 

 

Playing USS Bogue (CVE-9) Is a tactcally stragegy for pros player to play with since it got a limited plane and airgroup normally when i see noobs play bogue i will just be like "Oh great our CV is a fail"

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The jump from the Indy to the Ranger is quite something. You actually have proper reserves now. However, here comes the next hurdle: loadouts. 

 

I have the Lex now, and I was struggling with the Ranger since I was on a big break when I just bought the Ranger and I ended up with low avg damage due to overextension (getting myself killed/sniped was common).

 

That aside, you only really have 2 choices: 202 or 013. Hiryus can be assumed to be 222. 312s are rare. I played 202 Ranger twice and didn't like it (not fun, about 1500 XP each). 013 is far more fun when you go full damage and just rain death on the enemy team especially if you snipe the enemy CV. Of course, I get sniped in this loadout and end up with 0 damage a few times, but games with over 100k damage are not rare. Arsonist and witherer are also easy to get when you spam fires on BBs.

 

On the Lex, the situation is the same, but both 202 and 013 get buffed by monster DBs. 013 is fun as hell to play. Looking forward to the Essex (finally, a fighter!).

 

Also, the AA buffs are negatively affecting me, but the most important thing still stands: if you are alone in a BB/DD or with no escort, you will still get focused and killed.

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The jump from the Indy to the Ranger is quite something. You actually have proper reserves now. However, here comes the next hurdle: loadouts. 

 

I have the Lex now, and I was struggling with the Ranger since I was on a big break when I just bought the Ranger and I ended up with low avg damage due to overextension (getting myself killed/sniped was common).

 

That aside, you only really have 2 choices: 202 or 013. Hiryus can be assumed to be 222. 312s are rare. I played 202 Ranger twice and didn't like it (not fun, about 1500 XP each). 013 is far more fun when you go full damage and just rain death on the enemy team especially if you snipe the enemy CV. Of course, I get sniped in this loadout and end up with 0 damage a few times, but games with over 100k damage are not rare. Arsonist and witherer are also easy to get when you spam fires on BBs.

 

On the Lex, the situation is the same, but both 202 and 013 get buffed by monster DBs. 013 is fun as hell to play. Looking forward to the Essex (finally, a fighter!).

 

Also, the AA buffs are negatively affecting me, but the most important thing still stands: if you are alone in a BB/DD or with no escort, you will still get focused and killed.

 

Getting 1500XP on the AS loadout Ranger is already great.

I agree with just about everything and I'm excited on getting on the Lex with those thousand pounders.

I personally doubt I'd go for Essex or Midway though and stop with the Lex since she was my goal in the first place. One of my gripes is that high tier play is heavily influenced on how to handle each team's DDs(due to the type of gameplay) where USN CVs just don't have the tools to neutralize them unlike the IJN.

 

(To Add: I get a bit greedy on the Ranger and go balanced loadout of 1/1/1 and try to out damage and get air superiority against a 2/2/2 Hiryuu. It doesn't always work out, but it makes for much consistent play/balance on both damage and team support albeit being harder.)

Edited by SZYZWY

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Getting 1500XP on the AS loadout Ranger is already great.

I agree with just about everything and I'm excited on getting on the Lex with those thousand pounders.

I personally doubt I'd go for Essex or Midway though and stop with the Lex since she was my goal in the first place. One of my gripes is that high tier play is heavily influenced on how to handle each team's DDs(due to the type of gameplay) where USN CVs just don't have the tools to neutralize them unlike the IJN.

 

(To Add: I get a bit greedy on the Ranger and go balanced loadout of 1/1/1 and try to out damage and get air superiority against a 2/2/2 Hiryuu. It doesn't always work out, but it makes for much consistent play/balance on both damage and team support albeit being harder.)

As for DDs, I don't know about you, but I got plenty of practice torping them since a few months ago. They are XP-dense targets that are very rewarding to kill (and with buffed AA, that makes them even more attractive).

 

Try dropping on DDs for extra XP points and win opportunities. They are usually alone at the start and if the enemy fighters are not on point you can usually bomb the DD before anyone can react (try TBs first; DBs are hard to aim on DDs but I actually deleted a Kiev yesterday with 7/18 bomb hits using Lex). Warning: landing a bomb on the AA gun/main turret may result in no physical damage to the DD.

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I personally doubt I'd go for Essex or Midway though and stop with the Lex since she was my goal in the first place.

 

Very good decision. CV's life is already a hell nowadays, don't make it harder by going up to high tiers.

 

CV gameplay is just a shadow of how fun it used to be and quite sad that new CV players can't experience that.

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As for DDs, I don't know about you, but I got plenty of practice torping them since a few months ago. They are XP-dense targets that are very rewarding to kill (and with buffed AA, that makes them even more attractive).

 

Try dropping on DDs for extra XP points and win opportunities. They are usually alone at the start and if the enemy fighters are not on point you can usually bomb the DD before anyone can react (try TBs first; DBs are hard to aim on DDs but I actually deleted a Kiev yesterday with 7/18 bomb hits using Lex). Warning: landing a bomb on the AA gun/main turret may result in no physical damage to the DD.

For DDs, its more of a personal issue of mine with regards to consistency. DBs being RNG heavy and the TBs either being full hit or all miss depending on how DD reacts is like rolling a pair of dice. One of the dice being the timing of the drop while the other is how the DD reacts. Of course, from a DDs point of view, I understand the RNG involved since it would be REALLY unfair if a CV can just bomb them with impunity with DBs. Not much counterplay in that. The TBs however being 'all or nothing' against a DD is undesirable to me compared to how I do it in an IJN CV which has a spare TB squadron.

 

(Now that I wrote that, it really is a personal issue. I'm just too concerned with consistency :P.

That, and I'm really unlucky with RNG stuff. I never got more than 1 bomb to hit a DD even with a perfect drop. Main reason BBs hate me too)

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For DDs, its more of a personal issue of mine with regards to consistency. DBs being RNG heavy and the TBs either being full hit or all miss depending on how DD reacts is like rolling a pair of dice. One of the dice being the timing of the drop while the other is how the DD reacts. Of course, from a DDs point of view, I understand the RNG involved since it would be REALLY unfair if a CV can just bomb them with impunity with DBs. Not much counterplay in that. The TBs however being 'all or nothing' against a DD is undesirable to me compared to how I do it in an IJN CV which has a spare TB squadron.

 

(Now that I wrote that, it really is a personal issue. I'm just too concerned with consistency :P.

That, and I'm really unlucky with RNG stuff. I never got more than 1 bomb to hit a DD even with a perfect drop. Main reason BBs hate me too)

Yeah, I understand your concern. DBs can be really fickle. You can easily miss all 18 bombs, or land 3 and then take off 9100 HP from some poor DD.

 

TBs... Yeah it depends who you are facing. For the most part, they are not very used to dodging TB (turning in only 1 direction, sailing in a straight line, or even slowing down when speeding up would have saved them). Test the waters first. If the DD looks like an easy target or is tunnel-visioning then go for it for 2+ hits that can kill a full-HP DD. If a target is weaving in a S-motion repeatedly then you will need high skill to land even 1 (cross-drop).

 

That said, the one thing that makes me want to drop on DDs is that 1 hit on a DD is worth 5+ on a BB (more for TB since DDs have no bulges)

Edited by stratmania

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IJN is great when you have 3 TB squadrons at once, trick is just getting them to target in one piece. But that many torps can kill a BB no worries at all. (of coarse once the other guys fighters see you, getting home is an issue). But I loved my JP. I have been starting fresh with the USN CV's an hated the "borg" CV lol, but now I got used to it, it isnt bad. Though running the AS load is kinda boring. Because as I just learned today. if you get cocky an get sucked into a mass of AA ships, your done... I always went strike on my JP CV's an didn't do to bad, that was before everyone started going AS of coarse.

 

Considering buying the Lexington today, though not sure I wanna blow all my XP an credits on one ship. When I am still getting used to that little fat arsed Borg :)

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IJN is great when you have 3 TB squadrons at once, trick is just getting them to target in one piece. But that many torps can kill a BB no worries at all. (of coarse once the other guys fighters see you, getting home is an issue). But I loved my JP. I have been starting fresh with the USN CV's an hated the "borg" CV lol, but now I got used to it, it isnt bad. Though running the AS load is kinda boring. Because as I just learned today. if you get cocky an get sucked into a mass of AA ships, your done... I always went strike on my JP CV's an didn't do to bad, that was before everyone started going AS of coarse.

 

Considering buying the Lexington today, though not sure I wanna blow all my XP an credits on one ship. When I am still getting used to that little fat arsed Borg :)

 

It's gonna be harder on you when you get the Indy.

Getting to the Ranger however is a breath of fresh air.

So might want to save your free EXP and creds rather than straight buy to Lady Lex, seeing as you are in the Bouge for now. :great:

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It's gonna be harder on you when you get the Indy.

Getting to the Ranger however is a breath of fresh air.

So might want to save your free EXP and creds rather than straight buy to Lady Lex, seeing as you are in the Bouge for now. :great:

If you don't play Indy and Ranger for some experience then you will have trouble playing lady lex since her loadout got nerfed.

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