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Cyanide7662

IJN CV nerf in 0.5.1... WTH...

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Alpha Tester
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As the title states, but dont get it wrong, im not here to start a flame fest between players, but more for a discussion on what the HELL WG is doing with IJN CVs.

 

Since i cant post on the news topics page regarding patch 0.5.1, ill post it here

 

"U.S. bomber planes will be more stable while under anti-aircraft fire: their bomb spread in these circumstances will be slightly decreased. As for their Japanese counterparts, they will have increased precision for manual release - something loved by many an experienced aircraft carrier captain. Japanese torpedo bombers underwent major balance changes. Their torpedoes will now inflict less damage at lower Tiers."

 

'For the love of...
Not only from tier 8 on-wards are the US CVs better than the IJN in all aspects, now they'll better at lower tiers as well. What incentive is there to play IJN CVs anymore?

 

Midway = 10-12 torp hits for 9500 damage each thanks to the narrow spread. 95k - 114k damage total.
Hakuryu = 4-6 torp hits AT BEST for 8500 damage each thanks to wide spread. 34k - 51k damage total.

 

Midways aircraft are better in every aspect but fighter DPS. Service time doesnt matter, since one strike is all it takes for US, while IJN have to keep killing them with mosquito bites. Now youre making it essentially the same thing at the lower tiers? where there is no benefit or incentive to use fighters as you earn **** all for shooting down aircraft? for gods sake WG.... youre not balancing them at all.

 

I dont keep bringing this up out of bias, but for freaking balance. I WAS for the spread widened on IJN CVs to begin with, but then giving the US more damage was taking it too far. Balance would be IJN have higher damage and US have quantity of hits, or US have damage but wide spread, and IJN have narrow spread to compliment the quantity of squadrons.'

 

Can somebody explain to me why the hell WG are making the IJN CVs so god awful underpowered compared to the US CVs? Sure, they have to choose between fighters and bombers or bombers and torpedoes, but like i said, there is NO incentive to "do the right thing" and play with fighters for air cover when you get nothing out of it, and service time? dont make me laugh.

 

What. The. Hell.

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Super Tester
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As for their Japanese counterparts, they will have increased precision for manual release

 

Keep this part in mind, as to how this will play out... who knows?

 

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Super Tester
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As the title states, but dont get it wrong, im not here to start a flame fest between players, but more for a discussion on what the HELL WG is doing with IJN CVs.

 

Since i cant post on the news topics page regarding patch 0.5.1, ill post it here

 

"U.S. bomber planes will be more stable while under anti-aircraft fire: their bomb spread in these circumstances will be slightly decreased. As for their Japanese counterparts, they will have increased precision for manual release - something loved by many an experienced aircraft carrier captain. Japanese torpedo bombers underwent major balance changes. Their torpedoes will now inflict less damage at lower Tiers."

 

'For the love of...
Not only from tier 8 on-wards are the US CVs better than the IJN in all aspects, now they'll better at lower tiers as well. What incentive is there to play IJN CVs anymore?

 

Midway = 10-12 torp hits for 9500 damage each thanks to the narrow spread. 95k - 114k damage total.
Hakuryu = 4-6 torp hits AT BEST for 8500 damage each thanks to wide spread. 34k - 51k damage total.

 

Midways aircraft are better in every aspect but fighter DPS. Service time doesnt matter, since one strike is all it takes for US, while IJN have to keep killing them with mosquito bites. Now youre making it essentially the same thing at the lower tiers? where there is no benefit or incentive to use fighters as you earn **** all for shooting down aircraft? for gods sake WG.... youre not balancing them at all.

 

I dont keep bringing this up out of bias, but for freaking balance. I WAS for the spread widened on IJN CVs to begin with, but then giving the US more damage was taking it too far. Balance would be IJN have higher damage and US have quantity of hits, or US have damage but wide spread, and IJN have narrow spread to compliment the quantity of squadrons.'

 

Can somebody explain to me why the hell WG are making the IJN CVs so god awful underpowered compared to the US CVs? Sure, they have to choose between fighters and bombers or bombers and torpedoes, but like i said, there is NO incentive to "do the right thing" and play with fighters for air cover when you get nothing out of it, and service time? dont make me laugh.

 

What. The. Hell.

 

Please debate with this guy

http://forum.worldofwarships.asia/index.php?/topic/10114-next-update-ijn-cvs-will-be-op-again/

 

Also debate with Deicide.

Edited by Deathskyz

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Beta Tester
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You're bringing up things quite biased to support your claim.

 

First of all, you are claiming some damage numbers from tier 10 ships you never played nor experienced and that manifested from your "Service time doesnt matter, since one strike is all it takes for US". USN strikes indeed has chance to kill most ship in 1 very good manual drop from its 2 torps but only in very favorable conditions which are a lot to mention. Again, you never experienced it so you will never know and stop watching CV videos on youtube.

 

Second, quite a data manipulator you are. You indeed mentioned torpedo damage scaling for the IJN CVs in low tiers, but you failed to mentioned the new spread which will now make 4 torp hit possible for the IJNs.

 

Third, while bringing up damage numbers between the 2 tier 10 CVs, you failed to mentioned their rearming/servicing/reload speed in which IJN is almost twice as fast as her counterpart midway, not only in bombers but also for her fighters. If you factor that in, together with the new spread, you will get the proper DpS between the ships. Midway will remind you of a character that does an awful big critical strike, while a hakuryu a constant consistent DoT that surpasses the midway.

 

Fourth, I don't even know what are you bitching about the dive bombers. They both have good sides. USN diverss are now better "fire and forget penetrators" while IJN divers are now deadlier in the hands of the skilled captains.

 

Last and again, don't talk about ships you never experienced. Get them first then let's talk about them.

Edited by Deicide

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Super Tester
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but you failed to mentioned the new spread which will now make 4 torp hit possible for the IJNs.

 

That remains to be seen. It has yet to pass our testing.

An example

Edited by Deathskyz

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Beta Tester
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That remains to be seen. It has yet to pass our testing.

An example

 

i do hope it doesn't get implemented. IJNs CVs specially Taiho and Haku are already very strong right now. What really needs a change is to USN Cv's Air superiority loadouts/flight controls so at least they can match these two's flexibility- they need to put 1 torp bomber and change 302 to 311 starting from essex. If they do this, I'll eternally shut up about anything CV related.
Edited by Deicide

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Super Tester
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i do hope it doesn't get implemented. IJNs CVs specially Taiho and Haku are already very strong right now. What really needs a change is to USN Cv's Air superiority loadouts/flight controls so at least they can match these two's flexibility- they need to put 1 torp bomber and change 302 to 311 starting from essex. If they do this, I'll eternally shut up about anything CV related.

 

Believe me. I too want a 311 on my USN CVs.

Although the WR of the Midway does overperform compared to the Hakuryu's WR so its quite difficult to persuade the devs to change the high tier USN CVs.

Edited by Deathskyz

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Alpha Tester
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I'm on the ryujo, with 1 torp hit per battle, the ijn cv at tier 7 should be nerfed, then buffed then nerfed and then buffed again, by the time i get it....thats some 12 patches from now.

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"U.S. bomber planes will be more stable while under anti-aircraft fire: their bomb spread in these circumstances will be slightly decreased. As for their Japanese counterparts, they will have increased precision for manual release - something loved by many an experienced aircraft carrier captain. Japanese torpedo bombers underwent major balance changes. Their torpedoes will now inflict less damage at lower Tiers."

:sceptic:

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Beta Tester
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Believe me. I too want a 311 on my USN CVs.

Although the WR of the Midway does overperform compared to the Hakuryu's WR so its quite difficult to persuade the devs to change the high tier USN CVs.

 

That's actually right, though I don't know if the real stats looks like what warshipstats show, although I don't think they're that far apart. There are so much more that should be considered to determine a ship's balance than just staring at avg damages and winrates, so much more. what WG does is some short term bandages to what seems like a shallow wound, but doesn't really care what's going on underneath for it's all about what people can see outside. That and the fact that most players are just mediocres and just bad and their voices overwhelming; hakuryu does indeed need more micro control than midway to flesh out its real potential--something that is done but by a very few real skilled players whom I share the same opinion.

 

In the end though, I must admit WG is doing the correct thing and with all those stats, they just can't ignore which voice is the louder. No choice but we'll just have to go with the flow.

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Super Tester
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That's actually right, though I don't know if the real stats looks like what warshipstats show, although I don't think they're that far apart. There are so much more that should be considered to determine a ship's balance than just staring at avg damages and winrates, so much more. what WG does is some short term bandages to what seems like a shallow wound, but doesn't really care what's going on underneath for it's all about what people can see outside. That and the fact that most players are just mediocres and just bad and their voices overwhelming; hakuryu does indeed need more micro control than midway to flesh out its real potential--something that is done but by a very few real skilled players whom I share the same opinion.

 

In the end though, I must admit WG is doing the correct thing and with all those stats, they just can't ignore which voice is the louder. No choice but we'll just have to go with the flow.

 

Precisely. When it comes to balance the devs more or less prefer to look at numbers.

We STs provide much feedback but they prefer their statistics over our opinions most of the time when it comes to balance parameters.

Edited by Deathskyz

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Beta Tester
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It's about time USN Carrier get a buff. IJN CV had been pretty much a superior option until Tier 8, which they becomes equally strong.

 

Also, the role of the two nations' carrier had been reversed. IJN is now largely focusing on Balance loadouts like 2/2/2, or Air superiority loadout like 3/1/1(Ryujo) or 4/2/2 (Hakuryu).

 

USN Carrier up to Tier 8 is all about the 2/0/X loadout (Ranger is an exception, although I still prefer the 2/0/2 although it gives crap).

And after that it became damage dealer. Essex and Midway are both extremely lethal at that, while the Lexy had 2/1/1 which is a great balance loadout.

 

Deal with it. No more easy mode IJN CV games. Hopefully.

(Although I still do not believe CV is balanced. But we shall see.)

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It's about time USN Carrier get a buff. IJN CV had been pretty much a superior option until Tier 8, which they becomes equally strong.

 

Also, the role of the two nations' carrier had been reversed. IJN is now largely focusing on Balance loadouts like 2/2/2, or Air superiority loadout like 3/1/1(Ryujo) or 4/2/2 (Hakuryu).

 

USN Carrier up to Tier 8 is all about the 2/0/X loadout (Ranger is an exception, although I still prefer the 2/0/2 although it gives crap).

And after that it became damage dealer. Essex and Midway are both extremely lethal at that, while the Lexy had 2/1/1 which is a great balance loadout.

 

Deal with it. No more easy mode IJN CV games. Hopefully.

(Although I still do not believe CV is balanced. But we shall see.)

 

Don't worry in the next update every IJN CV captains will use the strike loadout from tier 6+ and to be honest they will suck at it at first. So 6 weeks after the update has been released US carriers captains will have a good time seal clubbing IJN CVs captains that have no idea how to do the torpedoes drop like the US CV captains :trollface:

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Beta Tester
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also possible to dodge all of em easier? to make 0 hit o.O

 

ya against  auto droppers, against experienced manual droppers, nope. attack 100 degrees from the bow 70 if turning from the outside. It all depends how this new spread looks like.

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Alpha Tester
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ya against  auto droppers, against experienced manual droppers, nope. attack 100 degrees from the bow 70 if turning from the outside. It all depends how this new spread looks like.

 

If I knew a university degree in mathematics was a prerequisite for this game, I wouldn't have bothered. Mines much higher.

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