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Hi Wow Developers, Just sharing some comments to consider if you wish to improve the submarine battle game play. Overall, the experience I've had since laying lands on my first few battles on the rental submarines has fallen far below my expectations. Having played older variants of submarine simulators such as Silent Hunters, Dangerous Waters etc., I must say that WoW has undermined the potency of submarines, and I'm sure that has caused much disappointment to many of us who were looking forward to the submarine battles. I've hence penned down some comments, bearing in mind that they are not intended to make WoW another submarine simulator, rather, I'm hoping below suggestions could help provide a better realism into the game by uplifting the great potentials of what submarines could do in real naval battle games. 1. Improve Submarine Stealth Stealth is the most important element of submerged submarines. How a submerged submarine maintains it stealth depends very much on (1) the speed at which it is running, (2) its operating depth (sonar detection varies by depth due to various bathymetric profiles in seas), and (3) self noise (e.g. from propulsion, machineries, activities etc.). Consider including such parameters into the game mechanics to make detection of submarines by ships' active sonars more challenging. For example, submarines would remain harder to detect at > 50m in general. In contrast, the 'depth' element in current game environment seemed to be underplayed, except to activate a consumable to evade to greater depth of 80m to avoid greater damage from depth charges. Ships' active sonars should generally have half the range compared to passive sonars due to the need for active pings to be bounced off an object to return to their transceiver. Furthermore, consider having the option for submarines to choose between active or passive sonars for target detection, as this would allow players to balance between real target acquisitions (active) vs remaining covert (passive). In reality, most submarines only operate on passive sonars to remain stealth. Should players choose to remain on passive sonars, they could rely on periscope for real target acquisitions (though at much shorter visual range due to low height of eye as compared to surfaced ships). For example, targets spotted by periscope or detected by active sonar would appear as 'true' (or red/blue) contacts on map, while those detected by passive sonar would appear as 'indicative' (or grey) contacts with a slower refresh rate. Operating on passive sonars would hence force submarines to remain on periscope depth for most of the time to visually confirm targets or attack (see point 3 below), unless they are evading to greater depths from depth charges. Submarine-to-submarine detection are not realistic in current game play, as they could easily detect each other as far as a few KMs away. In reality, submarines could only detect other submarines at very close ranges due to their silent nature as compared to surfaced ships. 2. Cavitation at high speeds Submarines should generally remain stealth and undetected as long as their speeds are kept below a certain speed. For example, submarine should be harder to detect when submerged at 1/4 speed, while they are easier to detect by hostile's passive sonars at 1/2 or more speed. This is however, not the case in current game play where there are submarines charging at full submerged speed undetected.3. Periscope + torpedo attack The periscope is one of, if not, the most important target detection equipment for WW2 submarines. Periscopes are predominantly used for target analysis (e.g. Angle-to-bow assessment, stadiametric ranging etc.) and target classification before pre-positioning submarines to fire their torpedoes - most of which are in fact straight running torpedoes until very much latter in WW2. Somehow, this aspect seemed to be neglected from current game play. Perhaps WoW could consider looking into how the periscope could be tied with torpedo firing at periscope depth as an alternate yet more accurate mode of attacking ships beside the current mode of pinging and homing? As far as I know, homing torpedoes are only developed much later into WW2, and there are potential risks of homing into friendly targets as well. I don't think torpedoes in 1930-1945 are smart enough to home only to hostile targets in the manner WoW set them up. In any case, isn't there a disjoint in logic where only submarines can have homing torpedoes while destroyers and cruisers are having straight running torpedoes in WW2? 4. Snorting In reality, charging of submarine batteries could only be done in 2 ways for most, if not, all of WW2 submarines (even in today's modern diesel-electric submarines); either (1) on surfaced, or (2) during snorting at periscope depth. It is factually NOT CORRECT to have WW2 submarines being able to charge their batteries at any depth while at 1/4 speed. This is because diesel engines need to be running to charge batteries, and there is no way diesel engines could run when submerged without a snort mast (for fresh air intake) - unless those are AIP (Air Independent Propulsion) submarines, which are modern technology. 5. Diving/Surfacing controls Consider having shortcut keys for submarines to reach surface, periscope depth, operating depth etc. instead of manually holding down 'F' and 'C' keys. 6. Parameters in detecting submarines The ability to detect submarines should be based on 2 principles; (1) visually, when they are on surfaced or snorting (e.g. through the wake made by the periscope/snort masts), and (2) noise generated by submerged submarines (e.g. during firing, cavitating or operating active sonar etc). Perhaps the game mechanics could consider having such parameters build in for submarines where detection is concern? While so much has been said to give submarines a better fighting chance, WoW could also consider including ASW aircrafts from carriers looking out for submarines at their periscope depth so as to balance off their stealth advantage those suggested above?

Any one else had this happen. I have had this happen so many times but due to being darn annoyed forget to take a screenshot. Only have these 2 screenshots. Scenario is this: You fire a perfect spread of torps at a DD or CL and they look dead on, so you turn your attention to the next enemy ship. You notice 4 or 5 torp hit indicators, but then realise the ship is not sunk. How the blazes does a DD survive 4 or 5 torp hits? I know when I'm in a DD I very very rarely (like 5%) survive taking 1 torp, but I'm left on 15% or less health from 100% health. Does this game model dud torps? Seems like only 1 torp from both my screenshots did any damage, all the others were duds. Both times enemy ship was hit by 4 or 5 torps but not sunk. In the Lo Yang game I sunk the Hatsuharu with guns after 5 torps didn't do the job, but in the other game a friendly Nurnburg had to finish the enemy kamikaze that survived 4 torps, only to then kill me with 1 torp.

I'm about half way on XP to the Shima now, so far have been happy enough with the F3 torpedoes but I haven't had the credits yet to try the longer range torpedoes. The damage with F3 I feel is possibly overly inconsistent. The games where they touch seem to keep giving but others - where the enemy seemingly only sails away from you - prove to be pretty poor for damage. Also with only 8km range you're forced to be creative to drop a sneaky smoke cleanser on smoke hogs that have some clue what they're doing, although the fact that they reach the smoke quickly is a nice trade off. Having said that I would not go back to the 93 mod.2 - seemingly too easy to dodge with a longer cycle time, I suppose both problems that come back with the 93 mod 3. So which one do you pick?

Torpedoes appear to have 100% accuracy upon impact. This is historically inaccurate. Some early US torpedoes had as little as 10% reliability rate. In a published diary of a Japanese submariner, mini sub after getting by defences in the harbour found that not all his torpedoes exploded on impact. Is it possible to have an inbuilt reliability factor depending on torpedo type?

Dear WG Dev's. To add some more realistic and historical accuracy to the game have you considered the following? 1. A minimum arming distance for all torpedoes, 2. Not all torpedoes ran or exploded, these were commonly known as DUDs how about putting in a random chance that torpedoes hitting but don't explode, or some of them their batteries (salt water activated) would not start up and torpedo would not run? You could then introduce a Commanders skill to overcome this or at least lower the percentage. You have RNG in shells so why not torpedoes?

Does this effect the Concealment for Destroyers? if so..... Be careful of Torpedoes

I ain't gonna sell it, sorry for being salty in the other threads. so, what are yall rolling with, shorter lead or lesser reaction time for the enemy? don't take reload time into consideration.

I kinda wondering,how exactly does a torpedo is launched? Especially on USN and Soviet navy ships since their launchers are placed in hard-to-access places. On Japanese ships,the torpedo launchers are accessible to the crews(since IJN ships can reload their torpedoes,most Allied warships can only use their torpedoes once) but I don't see any button,switches or anything that can trigger them.

Hi, Just really curious to know are you guys developing a World of Ships game or World of Torpedoes??? Like effing seriously WTF? You all need to either patch the damage they do or make their reload time ALOT longer that what it is, at one stage we were getting hit with I shit you not from 2 ships 19 torpedoes! Are you serious? Really? Not to mention torpedo bombers, why do they drop torpedoes from 10 meters from your ship?? Also your matchmaking needs some serious work, there are so many matches it is not even worth playing it isn't even a game its a cannon fodder match! I have been put with players wayyyyyy out ranking me and my team buy a country mile! I can understand this is an alpha or beta! But come on like have you guys even played this game? Classes like the battleship is useless! It's AA guns shoot like retarded AI from games in the 90's... Anyway that's my two cents now to get back to World of Torpedoes!

I was looking for a guide like this when I first started playing but couldn't find one, so I made it. I am not an experienced player ~ only started with open beta but thinking like this really helped me. I went from hitting one or two torpedoes a game to hitting 5~10. For this to work you need to know how your target is moving relative to you. I do this by checking both the mini map and zooming into the target with gun sights before going to torpedo sights. I always use the aiming guide (press x) but use it only as a reference (lead indicator). If you fire on the aiming guide you will only hit beginners And one more from the comments: And some more for anyone dorky enough...(thx amade) Again, I'm pretty beginner at this so take the where to fire advice with a grain of salt ~ thinking this way just helped me visualize how a target moving would affect its position relative to where my torpedoes might go. Any advice from more experienced players is welcome.

G'day folks, I thought I'd start a new thread which isn't bingo related with whining or crazy suggestions So I've been playing the Minekaze a while (shes a keeper) and starting to wonder what torpedoes you folks use? Initially, I liked the stock torps (7km range and 68 know speed), as I'm usually a USN DD player and like getting up close (well for USN you have no choice) and launching my fast torps at enemy ships, giving them no time to dodge and sealing their watery fate. They usually worked quite well in CBT as most players were skilled enough to dodge the slower 10km torps... But I've now grown to like the 10km ranged torps (57 knot speed), as the recent influx of new players means that many don't even bother trying to turn or taking head to the warning signs. Plus the 10km range allows me to fire at range and spam all the narrows and island corners while keeping at a safe stealthy distance, and they haven't been that slow at all to be honest. Until new players get better I think I'll stick with these and enjoy the fun while it lasts. What are your thoughts?

Wow, didn't see the men until Fear The Reaper pointed them out. Pretty grim. Deleted.

Destroyer's and How to not suck at it Short Introduction to the ship: -Destroyers (or DD for short) are small, fast maneuverable warship. They are intended to escort larger vessels in a fleet (mostly found outside of the formation next to the Heavy Cruisers). What's that? Escort other ships? Yes, they escort other ships too against other DD's with the intention of taking out your team's Battleships (BB) or Carrier's (CV) -Since DD's here is based on World War 2 our armament is the Torpedo (I will explain the Torpedo later) and several guns of different caliber and AA mounts to fend off other ships and aircraft. Short Introduction to the Torpedo: Bliss Leavitt Mark 8 Torpedo (the Torpedo you usually see on the USN DD ships) Type 93 nicknamed as the "Long Lance Torpedo" (you usually see this on the IJN DD ships) - Okay into the Torpedoes themselves. All torpedoes that hit the water both your teammates and enemy torpedoes are dangerous. So tread lightly when dealing against Destroyers both allied and enemies. - There are 2 kinds of Torpedoes used, the ship based Torpedo which packs a punch due to the size of the warhead, and the Aircraft based torpedo, although each torpedo lacks the punch of the ship based one what makes it hurt the most is the number of Planes that drops them. - Once hit by a Torpedo, depending on the location will cause flooding and a flooding icon will pop and your crew will say "Hull breach, were taking a lot of water". While your ship is flooded your movement will be reduced and you will receive constant damage if not repaired. What it looks like when you hit and caused flooding on an enemy ship. - Torpedoes vary from each nation, in terms of operating range of the torpedo, USN DD's tend to have shorter range torpedoes in exchange for rapid fire guns and fast turret turn rate. IJN DD's on the other hand has longer range in exchange for slow turning guns, some of which can reach 20km or so. The speed of each torpedoes may vary from ship to ship, some torpedoes has a speed of 50kt's some has 64kt's. - Detecting Torpedoes once on the water may also vary from the PoV (Point of View) of players, some may detect them early on and some being detected almost near your ship that it's impossible to dodge it. Usually they are detected around 5km to 1.5km. You will hear a distinct beeping sound/alarm once a torpedo is traveling near your ship to warn you and your crew will warn you on which direction the torpedo is ("Torpedoes to ____" ). The warning also applies to the torpedoes fired by your teammates. Destroyers and How to not suck at it: - Okay, onto the ship it self. one tip when using a DD is checking the range of the torpedoes first. For low tier DD's range may vary, USN DD on the low and mid tiers has a range of 4km to 6km, IJN DD's on the other hand on the low and mid tier has a range of 7km to 12km range, while on the higher tier USN DD's has 7km to 9km range and the IJN DD's range from 15km to 21km. - DO NOT FIRE TORPEDOES WHEN YOU HAVE FRIENDLIES NEAR YOU, I noticed some new players that they indiscriminately fire their torpedoes at random causing other players to dodge them and break formation or worse hit them and kill them in the process. Killing an ally ends you earning a negative score and a status of Team Killer (TK) >I'll continue tomorrow<

First and foremost, a disclaimer: I'm no naval historian. Just a student with access to the Googlespace. Heck, my college degree don't even touch the topic of torpedoes (because that would be weird), but I just have a strange love for the wonderful invention that is torpedoes, brought by the resurgence of my love for ships (thanks to KanColle, WoWS, and NF). So without further ado, TORPEDOES! Type 93 Model 22 torpedo being fired First off, a small history behind torpedoes. The first torpedoes were more akin to floating naval mines when first introduced. Another early type of torpedo was the spar torpedo, which little more than explody bits on a stick. The method of attack: stick the explody bit on the bottom of a ship using a (man powered) submarine or smaller boat, light the fuse, and hope you don't get blown up along with victim ship. As expected, this didn't go as well as intended, as evidenced by the H. L. Hunley's attack. The modern torpedo came into being by the invention of the Whitehead torpedo by Robert Whitehead. This had the form of a torpedo we all know and love (or love to hate) now, and was when the term torpedo came to describe self-propelled projectiles that traveled underwater or on water. By World War 1, torpedoes were already being used widely by both sides, most prevalently by the German U-Boats, sinking shipping in the Channel and disrupting supply lines. So I guess we could say the Whitehead torpedo was the granddaddy of modern torpedoes. Whether it had a white head or not, I am not sure. Even before World War 1, however, the Japanese were already catching on to this newfangled thing that was the torpedo. During the Battle of Tsushima in 1905, Japanese used torpedo firing ships to sink the flagship of the Russian fleet. During the interwar years between World War I and World War II, the Imperial Japanese Navy was at a disadvantage with the 5:5:3 capital ship ratio of the Washington Naval Treaty, especially in a naval battle with the United States in the Pacific. To combat this, and anticipating the US Navy's Plan Orange doctrine where the battle line would fight their way across the Pacific to relieve the Philippines, the IJN saw the need to whittle down the US Navy capital ships before a decisive battle could be fought. Thus, they focused on night battle doctrines, developing weapons suited for the role, which included torpedoes. By the 1920s, the Japanese and British were experimenting on pure oxygen torpedoes to combat the telltale wake of torpedoes as well as extend their range by increasing the amount of oxygen that could be burned inside. The research stopped in 1924 after many fatalities due to premature explosions, but continued in 1927 after a naval inspector reported that the Rodney appeared to be equipped with oxygen driven torpedoes. They found the fault in their torpedoes: sharp turns in the tubing compressed and heated the oxygen (because Gay-Lussac's/Amonton's Law), causing it to react with the left over oil in the tubing. They eliminated the sharp turns and cleaned the tubing with a strong alkali solution, which solved the problem. The tendency of the oxygen and kerosene mixture to violently detonate when exposed to the combustion chamber was also remedied by initially powering the torpedo with compressed air from "Air Tank 1" before gradually switching to oxygen kept in "Air Tank 2" (no, it isn't air, air is 79% Nitrogen and 21% Oxygen. It's labeled that way to fool people). After years of further testing, including firing them off cliffs to test depth control and using hulks to see the effect, in 1933, the Type 93 Model 22 (Kyū san-shiki gyorai) or also known as the Sanso gyorai (lit. Oxygen torpedo) was born. The Type 93 Model 22, nicknamed postwar as the Long Lance by Samuel Eliot Morison, was the most advanced torpedo of the time when it was introduced, and proved to be one right until the war ended, and even some years after. It had extremely long range with excellent speed, due to its powerful engine, capable of reaching 40,000m at 36 knots. In contrast, the standard US Navy destroyer torpedo of the war, the Mk 15, traveled 13,700km in 26 knots. Additionally, due to the constant debugging and testing of the Japanese pre war, the little kinks and troubles of the fuse was fixed, resulting in a very robust and reliable contact detonator, in contrast with the US Navy's... less than reliable detonators (though this did cost Japan Shinano due to overconfidence). It also carried a hefty 1080lb punch, enough to sink destroyers with one torpedo, and the heaviest cruisers with three. Finally, the Type 93 was also very, very stealthy, as the combustion products produced only carbon dioxide, which is quite soluble in water. Not all was rainbows and unicorns for the Type 93, however. It also had several drawbacks that made it deadly to carry the Type 93 itself, not just being hit by it. Because of its oxygen fuel, it was very dangerous to have it on deck when ships were being shelled. A direct hit to the torpedo magazine of a ship, or even a torpedo to the torpedo magazine of a ship, aside from being great irony, destroyed several Type 93 carrying ships during the war due to the secondary explosion of the tanks. The torpedoes also required meticulous maintenance, requiring highly trained maintenance personnel to watch over them, something that Japan would have shortage of in the late war years. However, despite these disadvantages, the Type 93 Model 22 torpedoes proved to be devastating to ships they hit, especially if hit in the extremeties of ranges, often accounting "stray" Type 93 hits as mines or undetected submarines. In fact, one Japanese submarine, I-19, probably carrying the submarine issue oxygen torpedo, the Type 95, fired the single most destructive torpedo spread of the war, severly damaging the carrier USS Wasp (which had to be scuttled later), sinking the destroyer USS O'Brien, and damaging the battleship USS North Carolina. It wasn't until the US captured documents pertaining to the torpedoes to convince allied leaders that, yes, Japan was able to make torpedoes capable of striking from 40km away, and striking hard and reliably. And now onto the ships! The Type 93 Model 22, and its submarine derivative, the Type 95, became the standard torpedo of the IJN when World War II broke out. It came in multiple packages, from double tube launchers to quad tube launchers, and even quintuple tube launchers on Shimakaze, who had THREE (but still not the most number) of them, and were mounted from heavy cruisers down to quick and speedy destroyers, allowing even the smallest ship in the IJN to heavily damage a heavy cruiser, as evidenced by Yuudachi (p-poi~) during Guadalcanal. During the development of the night battle doctrines and torpedo tactics, IJN decided to pull all stops and created surface ships capable of firing multiple torpedoes in one salvo: the Torpedo Cruisers, Kitakami and Ooi. IJN Kitakami and IJN Ooi in their Kuma-class configuration. There seem to be no pictures existing of their CLT configuration. Kitakami and Ooi (as seen moefied in my sig) both started out as simple Kuma-class light cruisers, both launched in 1920. By 1934, with the introduction of the Type 93 Model 22, they were slated to be remodeled into torpedo cruisers, carrying not 8, the most carried by the destroyers and cruisers at the time, not 10, but 40 tubes of Type 93 Model 22 Oxygen Torpedoes. Originally the plan was 44 tubes, but was knocked down to 40 each as 'only' ten sets of Type 92 quad 61cm launchers were available. That's two broadsides, five launchers each, of 20 Type 93 oxygen torpedoes coming at you. Is that OP, WoWS-wise? I have no idea, I'm a purple, not one of them greens. Sadly, by the time they were introduced, torpedo cruisers were no longer as effective as before in the light of of the carrier based warfare that was happening. During Midway, Kitakami and Ooi sortie together for the first time, and are together for the better part of two years. They unfortunately never use their new launchers, or at least I can't find a report that says they did. During Aug-Sep of 1942, they are once again remodeled into fast transports, reducing their ten launchers to six, and are assigned to troop transport operations. They sortie together until January of 1944, where Kitakami is torpedoed enroute to Singapore and forced to dock, and Ooi continues on the transport mission. Six months later, during rough seas in July 19, 1944, at 1046 Ooi is torpedoed by USS Flasher, and is hit by two torpedoes. One is a dud, while the other floods her aft engine room. Ooi sinks by 1725 of the day. Kitakami continued to serve as a transport ship after the sinking of Ooi. A month later, in 14th of August 1944, she undergoes a refit into a kaiten (manned torpedoes derived from the Type 93) carrier. All of her armaments are removed and replaced by AA guns and a crane taken from the remodeled seaplane tender Chitose for the purpose of handling the kaitens. Thankfully, Kitakami never uses any of her kaitens, and survives until the end of the war, being assigned to repatriation services. She is removed from the Navy List in November 30, 1945 and scrapped in 1946. While the torpedo cruisers were quite interesting ships, and probably could have been quite powerful had they been given the chance to show off their ability, they were inevitably outclassed and outperformed by the new dawn of carrier based warfare. Nonetheless, the Type 93 Model 22 torpedo continued to be used as the main IJN torpedo throughout the war. Kitakami and Ooi later lived on as JDS Isuzu-class destroyer escorts, decomissioned in 1993. Thanks for reading this quite long piece from me. Please comment if there are inaccuracies or anything I might add to it. If it seems a bit too biased towards IJN torps, especially that comparison part... well... it is a piece about IJN torps. Haha. Sources: